International Inspiration with Catherine Warren

International Inspiration with Catherine Warren

Kelly Kennedy: Welcome to episode 50 of the business development podcast. Still blows my mind that we are saying episode 50. It's so cool to have this milestone episode with you today. And on today's episode, if you've ever had questions about international business, and maybe you're looking to learn a little bit more about accelerator programs in your country or Canada or wherever you're at to really boost your business growth.

We have an absolutely top notch expert for you today. Catherine Warren, CEO of Edmonton Unlimited. Stay tuned.

Intro: Great Mark Cuban once said, Business happens over years and years. Value is measured in the total upside of a business relationship, not by how much you squeezed out in any one deal. And we couldn't agree more. This is the business development podcast based in Edmonton, Alberta, Canada, and broadcasting to the world.

You'll get expert business development, advice, tips, and experiences. And you'll hear interviews with business owners. CEOs and business development reps. You'll get actionable advice on how to grow business brought to you by capital business development, capitalbd.ca.

Let's do it. Welcome to the business development podcast, and now your expert host, Kelly Kennedy.

Kelly Kennedy: Hello, welcome to episode 50 of the business development podcast. Wow. That's so amazing to have such a milestone episode. You know, if you guys have been with us from the beginning, I appreciate you immensely. This show could not have hit. 50 episodes without the support of our lovely entrepreneurship listeners.

I appreciate each and every one of you. It's it's an honour. It truly is to be on this show and to be able to help you and work with you to grow your businesses week over week. And for this highlight episode, we have an Absolutely amazing expert interview for you today. We have Catherine Warren, the CEO of Edmonton Unlimited.

She is a trailblazing leader in innovation and governance with a unique background in climate physics and media innovation. She's driven change in tech entrepreneurship and non profit enterprises. As CEO of the Vancouver Economic Commission, Catherine attracted 3 billion dollars in foreign direct investment, propelling the city as a hub for education and industry collaboration.

She is also a driving force on the boards of publicly traded companies and non profits, including the United Nations World Summit Awards for Sustainable Developmental Goals. Catherine champions Canadian innovators on the global stage while fostering diversity in science and technology. Her insights have inspired positive change through books, media, and international keynote speeches.

With a visionary spirit, Catherine co founded a tech company that went public on the Nasdaq, achieving a 300 million market cap. Her media tech consultancy, Fan Trust Entertainment Strategies, thrives on complex international deals and attracting global investment. An avid adventurer who's worked in 60 plus countries, Catherine's current role as CEO of Edmonton Unlimited drives the city's tech sector growth and fosters inclusive innovation.

Catherine continues to inspire future generations through innovation. inclusion and determination. Catherine, how are you today?

Catherine Warren: I'm doing great. Thank you so, so much for having me join your audience. It's a pleasure to be here.

Kelly Kennedy: It's so cool. It's so cool to have you on today. And I, so, you know, I didn't know you all that well.

I was at an event that you were keynote speaking at, you were at the the Alberta accelerator global 500 Alberta accelerator early earlier this year. And when you got up on stage and chatted, I was like, yes, 100% I have to connect with Catherine. I have to have her on the show because your speech was amazing.

You were a total rock star.

Catherine Warren: Thank you so much. And that is a really wonderful and global program. So we can talk a bit about why joining a global accelerator could be a gateway to any entrepreneur's international business development experience.

Kelly Kennedy: Totally. Totally. I would love to hear about it. Although I also want to hear about you.

Can you give us like a flashback? You've been, you know, I told you this before the show, you have the most impressive executive resume I have ever seen. Total rock star. And you know, you've been doing this for over 20 years. You've been a high level executive for over 20 years. Take us back to the beginning of your journey.

You know, who was Catherine Warren 20 years ago?

Catherine Warren: Well, I like to go back just a little bit earlier than that to say that you know, I, my education really paved the way for a lot of what I do today. And you mentioned that you know, I have a degree in physics and I just want to encourage those of your listeners and especially female listeners that a background in science is a real shot in the arm.

It's a confidence science. Builder, it, you know, helps you puzzle out problems and exposes you to international research and whatnot. So, you know, for me, a lot of my thinking was shaped by the or, you know, kind of early decision that I made to go into physics, even though, of course, today I am not a physicist actually from there, I went on to Study journalism at the Columbia Journalism School to get a graduate degree.

And I, I pursued a topic of the, this whole new field that was emerging at the time, the field of digital media. And I had the privilege of doing my research at MIT, the Massachusetts Institute of Technology on the, scientists that were experimenting with the arts in particular, digital holography and computer music.

So that you know, really shaped my thinking about the ways that science and art and technology and the economy intersect. And you know, from there, I went on to. Publish children's science content, including multimedia and, and to kind of bring this really new and exciting you know, two way publishing experience to audiences around the world.

I, I lived and worked in, london following a stint in Geneva at the European Center for Particle Physics Research, CERN. And, and so I, you know, I, I did have this early opportunity. To live and work in different places to kind of immerse myself with the intersection of science, research, technology, art, design.

So it was a really great backdrop for what I later went on to do in my career, which was develop software for broadcasts entities and large news organizations. Kind of combining the technology with, with the content and that this is the company that you mentioned earlier that the partners and I took public on, on the NASDAQ, and that was a really exciting.

Ride, you know, to take a startup through to that kind of trajectory to be under that kind of scrutiny and in that regulatory environment you know, raising money in, in the U. S. and whatnot in order to take the company to new heights. And then from, from there, I went on to kind of move into this emerging area of fan engagement and community building online.

I, I realized that very quickly, the technology itself would be commoditized, and that a lot of the really exciting and strategic work was going to be in this area of how audiences impacted content and rights holders and how businesses were going to be shaped. By the evangelism and, and frankly, the criticism of, of fans and fandom.

And, and so I got very excited about you know, how to work in this like collaborative dynamic between businesses that were very used to in the past, like just delivering to their audiences kind of blind. Like you just. Put out your broadcast, you'd wait for the ratings to come in and you were kind of one and done.

And now you were actually forced to engage with the very people you were intending to entertain. And that became a very exciting and different value proposition. And. The companies that I have had the privilege to work with in, you know, television, streaming, e sports, video gaming and whatnot, the winning companies were the ones that really understood the power of that.

Interactivity and then just bringing us up to the present day. You know, over time, I thought, well, gee, I'm seeing a lot of success with this fan building and community building online. What would happen if I kind of challenged myself to do that in real world situations? And and who does that? Kind of work, like, who is who is exploring community engagement in a really serious way in a way that can kind of change the world.

And and that's how I moved my career into economic development. You mentioned that prior to coming to lead Edmonton unlimited. I was the CEO of Vancouver Economic Commission and, and before that I was the CEO of an innovation district called Canada Center for Digital Media, which is also in Vancouver.

So I had that experience of like you know, really building a community that included. Students, game studios, art galleries, transit hubs you know, dealing with, with housing issues and real estate deals and whatnot. So that, that was like my kind of next, next level experience with community building and now I'm very happy to be here in Edmonton.

Leading in you know, North America's northern most major city, the innovation authority here for the city and helping entrepreneurs and international entrepreneurs to you know, launch here. To land here to load here and to grow here. And we've recently opened an innovation center in the heart of downtown Edmonton.

So now, you know, again, kind of applying that very let's say destination based innovation leadership, which is so important for a city to thrive.

Kelly Kennedy: Wow. That is all that I could even say to that, Catherine. Like what a diverse, what a diverse career that you've led. It is unbelievable. You know, just, just the sectors and industries that you've affected, influenced, led.

You know, when you talk like that, it's, you know, for us podcast hosts, it definitely puts us in a spot where it's like, wow, like, where do we even lead off? Like, there's so much here. It's it's pretty wild. You know, you talked about something that I always find interesting is you know, essentially the importance for, for modern day founders, for modern day leaders to have a social presence, to have a front face to the customers, which like you said, never really existed before.

I've talked about that with quite a few of my guests where it's like moving forward, we're being challenged as, as owners, as founders, as presidents to step up and say, okay, you know what? Yes, we have a company, we have great products, but that's not enough anymore. Not only do you need to have a great product, you need to be well represented as a person on that stage as well.

And definitely that's a challenge, you know, I've run into that as a challenge with some of my founders that I've worked with, the companies that I've worked with, where that's a very uncomfortable thing, right? They're, most of them are introverted, they tend to be engineering type people, you know, they've built this amazing thing, but they're like, yeah, I don't want to be the face of this.

What kind of advice do you have for those people?

Catherine Warren: You know, this is, this is a quandary because you really want to play to your strengths. And if you you know, put yourself out there in a way you're not comfortable with, people will see that as inauthentic. So you know, I do think fortunately, there are so many nooks and crannies online to build a social presence that, you know, if you're super extroverted, of course you can.

I'd be an influencer on a platform like TikTok. But if you really want to go down a rabbit hole, you might be more comfortable on Reddit where you can still be a thought leader. So I would just say, find your platform and play to your strengths on that platform. And your audience will really see that authenticity and flock to you.

Kelly Kennedy: Yeah, no, agreed. Like the reality is you have to do something. But I think Catherine is totally on point where just find something that is your strength, where you can still express yourself where you can still come out and say something, you know, in a way that you're comfortable with. Yeah, I like that.

I've never heard the Reddit aspect of it before. Yeah, you know, most people just suck it up and take a video or do a podcast. But I've never heard the other aspect.

Catherine Warren: Yeah, there, there's so many ways to shine, you know, and slack is another opportunity. That's one of the reasons I'm sad about what's going on with Twitter.

You know, because I really appreciated that platform. It really suited. Me, it worked really well for community building. And I just no longer see that in spirit there.

Kelly Kennedy: Yeah. It, I don't know. It is tough. It's, it's kind of the first of the, of the platforms to really be affected or changed in a pretty monumental way.

Like, you know, whether it be Facebook or LinkedIn or whatever else you guys are using, those have stayed pretty. pretty much the same. They've had small innovations along the way, but the system is pretty much the same. And yeah, I, I don't use Twitter much, but I have heard that it's been a, it's been a challenge.

So Catherine, you touched on something that you know, when I was reading through the information learning more about Edmonton Unlimited and kind of what you're doing that I was not aware of. So Edmonton is the fastest growing tech center in North America.

Catherine Warren: Yeah, yeah. And we're we're unstoppable. We just got the results from the startup genome report.

And we, we grew again, 96% in the, in the new year in 2022. So we're really excited on the ground here, seeing this growth. Trajectory, you know, I mentioned earlier, we brought international accelerators here, including plug and play 500 global and alchemist. We also have our own accelerator in partnership with platform Calgary called.

Alberta catalyzer and so there's a lot of momentum for you know, bringing international startups here through those programs. And so any of your listeners all over the world are actually eligible to apply to any of these accelerators here and for free, you get a program that could truly help you up your game and change your, your business and put it on a global stage, attract international investment and whatnot.

So Edmonton is doing a lot of the very best things you can do to build an ecosystem of support and to offer free supports. To entrepreneurs and to really focus on what we call inclusive innovation and innovation for impact because, of course, you know, if you lean into you know, global issues like the climate emergency or public health or food security or digital inclusion or reconciliation, any number of things where you're going to see the greatest change and the greatest market interest you also have the potential, of course, to change the world and to attract enlightened investment.

So I would just encourage you know, your listeners to look at where can you have the most impact and where can you have the most global impact? Because you know, not only is that the right thing to do, but you will have a business success and you will leave a legacy.

Kelly Kennedy: Yeah, no, you hit on something with regards to the accelerator program.

So. I'm not sure that all of our listeners are aware of what an accelerator program can do for their business. Could you maybe just educate my listeners on what an accelerator program is and how it may help them?

Catherine Warren: Sure, sure. So you can think of it an accelerator as you know, a very, a very quick way to take your business to the next level, wherever you want to take it.

So let's say you know, you are already doing very well as a startup and you're looking to scale. Great time to get into an accelerator or a very early stage startup might want to join a pre accelerator like catalyzer. In any event, these programs bring together, you know, the best of the best in terms of teachers, coaches, mentors curriculum, you work in a.

Crucible environment with other business leaders and startup leaders and founders you are challenged to do all the, all the very best things for your business, your product market fit, your intellectual property, your customers, your potential investors and whatnot you are introduced to networks.

All over the world to grow your business, and then over time, you're also eligible for an investment by those accelerators. So you know, it's and you will be invited back. So you become an alumni of your accelerator. And as a result, you. Get the privilege to, you know, travel to their you know, annual events in Silicon Valley to meet with others from other cities around the world that have comparable or vision aligned businesses and to really grow through this network of, you know, high, high impact and at global leaders in business development.

Kelly Kennedy: Yeah, no, it's, it's amazing. And I've had, I've had the pleasure of sitting at one of these shows where they're demonstrating these companies and it's a lot of fun. It's really a lot of fun. And I would encourage anybody, if you have a very innovative product or service, you're looking for that next step, you're looking for some help.

You should definitely engage some type of accelerator program in your area and Edmonton unlimited would be a good, a great place to start.

Catherine Warren: Yeah, absolutely. Because we've brought these accelerators all here, but the under the terms that they're not only building the businesses that are based here, but they're also attracting other businesses from all over the world to use these accelerators again at the same, like no cost price point.

Kelly Kennedy: Yeah, that's that's a pretty good deal.

Catherine Warren: Very good deal. Very, very good deal. And it just it's shining a spotlight on our city in a in a really new and exciting way. And and I think once you've had a taste of Edmonton, there's no going back. You'll You'll fall in love with the people here.

Kelly Kennedy: Yes, yes. Edmonton, you know, I've had so much success in this city. Just, you know, with my own business or with working with other companies that I work with locally. It's such a great business community and a helpful community. And you know what? I don't think I've ever asked for help here from another business owner or from another organization.

And they just said, no, sorry, not interested in helping you. And this could be even people that were in a similar industry. We are a very, very well organized city, well organized, you know Situation. And with regards to that, like I said, if you need help, it's typically there. And, you know, there's lots of great organizations such as yourself, such as Edmonton Unlimited, such as, you know, the Edmonton Chamber of Commerce, who I've had just endless amounts of help from there.

They've been absolute rock stars with regards to not only my business, but even helping me with some client businesses that I'm working with and trying to make connections. So there's there's lots of opportunity here and I would highly, highly encourage, you know, if you're listening from somewhere else in Canada and you're looking for a place to go, we're wide open right here in Edmonton.

Catherine Warren: We are we are talent central. So come join the party.

Kelly Kennedy: Absolutely. So take me back three years ago, Catherine to to the founding of Edmonton Unlimited. You know, what was the reason? Why was Edmonton Unlimited created?

Catherine Warren: Well, Edmonton Unlimited was created by a visionary city council. You know, Edmonton is a A progressive city, a city that's interested in diversifying its economy in supporting early stage founders in helping businesses scale and grow and stay here and reinvest here.

So with that in mind the city established the municipal innovation authority and, and we work collaboratively across. Industry, academia, civil society and leading peer cities around the world to foster an innovation ecosystem for the benefit of all. So, we like to say that we position Edmonton as a global innovation capital and specifically.

And inclusive global innovation capital and a city of innovators, tackling these great global challenges that I mentioned a few moments ago. And we want to maximize these innovators for maximum international impact and support this triple bottom line of people, planet and prosperity, because, of course, we're somewhat different from the private sector.

You know, we're a municipal entity. We're not a VC or an angel group. We are here for the benefit of all Edmontonians.

Kelly Kennedy: Wow, that, that's amazing. So is it, is it completely publicly funded?

Catherine Warren: It is publicly funded. Of course, we do raise funding from other orders of government in addition to the city.

So the city of Edmonton gives us what's called core funding, and then we go out with ideas for fantastic initiatives to support founders to other orders of government, for example the province of Alberta, Alberta Innovates and the federal government through what's called prairies, Canada and, and with that support we invest that right back into the community.

So we offer dozens of free programs, including the accelerators I mentioned. Earlier, we have this fantastic collaborative working space where, you know, any entrepreneur who's involved in our programs can come at no cost and hop on our Wi Fi and hot desk here and have their meetings here where anyone in the city can join us for.

Community coffees every Wednesday from 9 to 11 for networking and, you know, just getting to know one another. And so all all of this is how we're contributing back to the innovation economy here. And it's working because you cited that extraordinary growth and a lot of that is because of the grassroots startups that we have here who do a lot of self organizing.

And, you know, I was just at a fantastic event last night hosted by a satellite company that's called Wyvern. They're a spinoff from the University of Alberta, very young founders. And they are the First company ever to be in space before they've even done a series a round. And so they, they credited this, you know, very robust community of support in helping them get from a student project.

To a highly investable high growth company with satellites in space right now in a few short years.

Kelly Kennedy: That absolutely blows my mind. It's, it's, yeah, that's crazy. That's absolutely nuts. That must have been a great time.

Catherine Warren: It was a great time. Very great time.

Kelly Kennedy: Yeah. So, oh yeah, like this is, you know, even I'm learning here because like, you know, I've, I've known about Edmonton Unlimited, but like, I haven't known the full depth of what it is that you guys do.

So I really appreciate this education. I'm learning just as much here as all of our listeners are like, what would you say is the greatest strength of Edmonton Unlimited as an organization?

Catherine Warren: Well, we are change makers. I think one of our greatest strengths is how we define Innovation. For example, we define it as something that new that contributes to significant positive change.

So we're here to support those changemakers at every level, whether you're very early stage startup, and that's where we do, you know, the lion's share of our programmatic work. But you might also be a multinational that needs to innovate, that needs proximity. To early stage startups in order to shake up and transform you know, a, a transitioning industry or sector.

So we you know, we like to say that we're kind of a crucible for innovation and innovators. We also support other high growth innovators beyond technology innovators, because of course, over time as. Tech Tech, A. I. and Machine Learning become kind of the bedrock of all companies. It's no longer maybe satisfying to just say, I'm a tech company.

It's really more about okay, what do you do? Who are your clients? How are you changing the world and what kind of impact are you going to have? And that's, what's going to inspire client confidence and investor confidence. So we take this very broad approach to who is an innovator, what innovation is, and we're trying to support it at all levels of society.

Kelly Kennedy: Yeah. What, like, so, you know, obviously you're supporting high levels of tech. Is there certain, is there certain technologies that, that we're, that we're prioritizing or that we're working towards? Or are we, are we kind of taking more of a blanket approach and saying, yeah, we'll take a look at all of them equally?

Or are there certain things specifically that we are, we are trying to create?

Catherine Warren: Really great question. So you know, if, if you come to us with a great idea for a high growth company, we're, we're not going to turn you away because you're in you know, prop tech and we're focused on machine learning or something.

It's not like that. We, we are encouraging you to come to us because you have a high growth, highly innovative idea or business that your trying to take to the next level.

We're very much technology agnostic, but we're also you know, agnostic across other sectors that said, in terms of Edmonton's. Bench strengths. You know, we are very well positioned, for example, to be the global leader and ethical and responsible. A. I. We are extremely well positioned to become a global.

Hydrogen epicenter, so Edmonton, of course, has core competencies and no surprise that they would be in things like you know, Energy or A.I., when you consider, you know, we have the research capacity of University of Alberta here and our. Tradition of kind of fueling the world. But, you know, we're also seeing really exciting tack and really exciting high growth companies verbal up in other areas.

So we have you know, life sciences with companies like, you know, future fields, which has like protein innovation. We have companies like Wyvern that are putting satellites in space like Grengine that have a clean battery solution with, with a mission to end energy poverty for good, or the synthetic big data company run with its synthetics that is running models.

For cities all over the world to determine what they need as they grow over time on route to net zero. So just so many exciting, promising companies here companies that are raising capital companies that are. Finding novel ways to finance themselves and everything in between.

Kelly Kennedy: Yeah, that's so, that's so amazing.

That's you're so fortunate to be able to lead some, an organization that has that much great influence on the world. Catherine, that's an absolutely amazing place to be.

Catherine Warren: Thank you. I, I feel that way too. I really do.

Kelly Kennedy: Yeah. It's, you know, the reality is I look at some of these technologies coming up and how, and how 100% they are going to bring benefit to the world around us and in ways that we can't even imagine, you know, and it's so cool that, you know, there's companies and organizations such as yours that are out there trying to encourage these companies to take that next step to take the leap.

You can do it. You can change the world and they need that help. And you know, it's really amazing. And, and thank you for doing that for us.

Catherine Warren: Yeah, well, well, I you know, it's really a credit to this ambitious city to have an innovation authority. It does not exist in every city around the world. And I, I would say, you know, if if you're a municipal leader and a listener in another jurisdiction, I would encourage you to consider developing an innovation authority for your city and your community. It will pay dividends. It will attract and retain the talent. That you have through your education system, and it will attract ultimately a foreign direct investment.

So there's, there's so much good that comes of investing in you know, creating this fabric of innovation across the city.

Kelly Kennedy: Absolutely. Absolutely. Being a public funded company. You know, are there ways that local business that are already in operation can kind of support what you guys are doing? How, how is it that local business could potentially support you?

Catherine Warren: You know, there are a lot of ways to sponsor entrepreneur programs that we offer. We have a wonderful event annually, Edmonton Startup Week, where, where businesses really do step in and support. And they you know, between the hosting that we offer and the community offers at large, we have more than 80 events happening this October 10th to 14th.

So you know, if. If you're inclined to sponsor or support entrepreneurship in this city, we're a great place for you to invest that time, talent and treasure. We'll make sure that it's distributed fairly and equitably across the city.

Kelly Kennedy: Oh, that's amazing. That's amazing, Catherine. And I'm sure, I'm sure you'll have lots of support from Edmontonians.

You know, we're loving what you guys are doing and we're excited to see what comes next. That's the truth. Thank you so much for giving us that overview. Me and you had an amazing conversation before, you know, when we were talking about what to do with this show, where can we go with this? And we got into a topic that I am very excited about.

And I knew you were excited about, and that is international business development. And I know that I just got a cheer from like a whole bunch of listeners to this show who have asked me, Kelly, give me tips on international. And I'm like, I've only done business in North America. I need help . And today you have had many, many, many experiences in international business development.

I would say that you are a leader in international business development and I am really excited to pick your brain and and to be on a learning journey with you.

Catherine Warren: That's great. That is so great. It's definitely my jam It is one of my favorite topics. I'm so happy that you're, Listeners are psyched about it.

I understand you have listeners all over the world. So you know, I, I would love to get feedback and input on their experiences you know, going the other direction doing international business development towards North America. Very interesting topic.

Kelly Kennedy: Totally, totally. So take us, take us back to your first international business development experience.

How did that come about?

Catherine Warren: So my first international business development experience happened with my first like real job. I was an editor of a computer magazine based in Austin, Texas. And I was, I was hired by a a company called Wilson Publications and they wanted to send me on a business trip to another.

State in the U. S. So I was a Canadian who had just arrived in Texas, got it, got a new job, and they sent me to I think it was Washington D. C. But the company used to have a private plane. This was like back in the day. Wow. And, what I didn't realize was that everyone on the team before I arrived had survived a plane crash.

And so they were not very keen to travel. And I, as the newbie had the privilege, of course, I flew commercial, the plane, no longer the private plane no longer existed. And we never had a private plane after that. And thank goodness because of the environment. But my, that was my first like. Serious business trip.

But I, no, I really got a taste for you know, what it was like. I, I moved from let's see, where was I living? I guess I moved from New York where I was a grad student to Texas. And so that, that really was worlds apart right there. And, and kind of gave me a taste for another part of the U S.

So, one thing to consider about international business development is it can be quite regional. So just diving into some specifics, like you do not wear what you wear in New York in Texas, nor do you wear what you wear in Texas in Washington, D. C. And so I would say that it you know, thinking ahead about.

Where you're going being able to look online and get a feel for what that culture is like before you go is ever so critical. And, you know, I, of course, that that option did not exist for me at that time. But now we're also fortunate because you can go online and you can actually, let's take a startup week.

For example, let's say we're going to start up with Chile. You can actually. Look at videos from all last year's startup week. You can prepare yourself. You can see you know, how do people treat each other? What do they wear? What is the weather like, et cetera. And, and so, you know, today we really have a head start.

We live in a global economy. A lot has changed and that makes it a lot easier. For even very early stage companies to get out there and appear very sophisticated and impress the culture that you're parachuting into by valuing and respecting their customs.

Kelly Kennedy: It's, it's funny. You actually hit on a topic.

That I haven't yet addressed on the podcast, which may have to come up now that you've hit on it was just, was just dressing for appropriately for different meetings, right? Like you kind of hit the nail on the head with like, you wouldn't dress the same for like California or you would for Texas type thing, but even like locally here.

You wouldn't go to like a downtown meeting in Calgary without, you know, a nice suit on or something like that. However, if you were doing like, you know, a small business and, you know, business development introduction locally, you probably wouldn't show up in a full suit and tie. You would show up in, you know, a polo or something like still like business, business casual, but business casual, right?

Catherine Warren: Oh, you are so right. You're so right. And sometimes A business trip is like, you know, or maybe semi around the world and you're packing for two totally different environments. I'm thinking of one of my trips where I had to go to a television trade show in Miami, which is like very like spangle hot pants and tube tops.

To Abu Dhabi for a UN sustainable development goal related conference. And so, you know, kind of packing for those things in a carry on is quite the challenge, but I cracked it. And that is my other top practical travel tip is never. ever check your luggage.

Kelly Kennedy: Good tip. Good tip. I would fail that epically. So how does someone know they're ready to take on international business development?

Catherine Warren: Well, everyone is ready to work internationally. A lot of this comes down to mindset. And we're very fortunate to have this exposure as we do living in a, you know, globally connected world to so much international in our lives. So, whether we're watching you know, a Scandinavian show on Netflix and reading subtitles or reading an international newspaper on our phone, we have a lot of exposure to international, which helps us grow this international mindset.

It's also important to reach out to people in the you know, intended destination of travel in advance and start building rapport before you hit the ground. There are trade commissioners in Canada, for example, Global Affairs Canada and other National organizations that are very happy to help you with positioning with referrals, setting up meetings, accompanying you to meetings participating in translating things with you.

And so, you know, and this holds true in other jurisdictions too, but we, as Canadians are particularly fortunate in that regard. So, so I would say that if you're, if you're building a business, you need to be thinking internationally. You need to be thinking globally. If you want to have that high growth opportunity that, you know, Kelly, you and I are talking about.

Kelly Kennedy: Yes. Yes. So like, what if you've never been abroad, right? Like, I think a lot of people listening to this, they probably haven't experienced or they're, you know, they might be being asked by their work to start looking into international business development, that sort of thing. You know, obviously there's some nerves there, you know, and, and I hate to say it, but there's, there are places in the world that are just not safe.

And, and how do you prepare yourself To be able to go internationally.

Catherine Warren: Yeah, Well, we'll tackle the safety one because wherever you are in the world, your own embassy will provide, your own country will provide travel advisories. So you, you know, especially now, you do want to check those because of, you know, we're seeing these extraordinary fires, for example, heat domes you know, it's possible You're, you're also worried about gun violence or terrorism or what have you.

So it is very important to you know, be travel safe, be travel smart and to know what your own government is advising you to do. So that's, that's definitely part of the prep. You know, and, and it may be that you're going as part of a delegation and we could talk a bit about that. You know, if you are, you're going to want to stay close to the delegation coordinators who typically are responsible for checking a lot of that on behalf of their delegates.

Yeah, another thing you know, or just visas. So they, they can take a long time making sure that you have the paperwork that you need. I think we're all getting a bit more sophisticated around that having been through. COVID where there were, you know, there was just a boatload of paperwork and you know, apps and in some cases, bureaucracy that we had to wade through in order to get you know, get back on the road.

So making sure that your passport is not going to expire. Within a certain timeframe after you depart is, is also another really important thing to check. And then my, my dad, who was also a super duper global business traveler gave me the best tip ever. Which is pack your suitcase, take out half the stuff, take twice the money.

So you know, I will say that international business development you need to avail yourself of things like grants and other opportunities that your country might offer in order to support international and then get tips on the ground from peer startups. They're going to know all the best places to buy local.

Coffee, they're going to know where the best cheap and cheerful hotels are. They're going to know where you can go out for fun and not have to spend too much money. So you know, your peers on the ground are going to be your support network.

Kelly Kennedy: Awesome. Yeah. Like I think. Oh, yeah, it is. It is a scary proposition, I think, especially for a business, which is kind of one of the things that we had talked about before this, and you touched on it.

You need to make sure that kind of everything goes to plan because the costs can skyrocket rather quickly. How does a company how does a company budget for an international opportunity or to even start doing this.

Catherine Warren: Well, first of all, just going back to your previous comment. Nothing ever goes to plan when travel is involved.

Right? So I think you know, packing a boatload of patients is is probably more important than, you know, taking out half your. I, I, I do think budgeting is critical because it forces, especially early stage companies to look at the ROI. And so you know, early in my career, I developed this kind of shorthand process that I use, which was, I started with the goals of the trip.

Like what am I there to do? How many meetings can I target you know, realistically, how many followups could I do when I returned? And you know, what what is the monetary value of this trip to me? Like, what do I want to get out of it for myself or for my clients? So that, that kind of helps set the vision side of the plan.

And then you can say, okay, in order, you know, if, if this trip is going to pay off with You know, to the tune of, say, a quarter million dollars, then you know, I am very willing to spend the 10 grand. To to get there and have this experience. You know, if not, you might decide, you know what I can do this online, or I can hire someone locally to do this for me and I don't need to travel and I can save on the carbon footprint.

So a lot of considerations there, but I would very much say. You know, the budget needs to follow the goals and then you need to hold yourself to your own targets and deliverables because after all, as an entrepreneur, you are working for yourself. And that means you have those obligations to yourself and your business.

And you know, one thing that you know, not everyone might appreciate is the travel is only as valuable as the follow up on return. So the follow up is absolutely critical and making sure that you can you have the bandwidth to do the follow up that you need to capitalize on the investment that you've made.

So, you know, for example, it is rare when you're traveling overseas, unless you're there to sign on the dotted line that you will close those deals while you're overseas while you're abroad. And. It's it's far more likely, especially with early stage business development, that you'll be making great connections that will become future clients.

But you will likely have to close those deals when you return or on a subsequent business trip. So making sure that you have what it takes to do that follow up. And give those returns to your, to yourself, to your startup, to your team, to your shareholders and what have you is absolutely critical in terms of you know, maximizing the value of the trip.

Kelly Kennedy: Absolutely. And I want to touch on that quickly because, you know, I mean, that that's just as relevant here. back home as it is internationally, right? You know, when you've made the introduction, you have to do the follow ups. And the statistic is something crazy, Catherine. It's like only most people give up after one follow up call.

And it's like, No, no, no, no, no, no, no. You need to do a follow up call weekly until, until you either disqualify the person or you get that meeting again. Right? Because the goal is always to get to the next meeting, next meeting, next meeting, and eventually the RFP and the closure of your deal. But you need to be consistent.

You need to hold yourself accountable to those follow up calls.

Catherine Warren: Yeah, you absolutely do. And you know, I think that the world is full of openers and very few closers. So be a closer everyone be a closer.

Kelly Kennedy: And it's not that hard. Let me just let me just put that out there. It's consistency, right? You need to be consistent in your follow up.

If you are consistent and my rule of thumb is always one call a week until you either get disqualified or get your meeting. But as long as you're consistent with that, you're going to get more meetings than get more disqualifications and you're going to close a lot more deals.

Catherine Warren: Yeah, and that actually brings up a really good point.

So one of the successes that I experienced in international business development was what I call the repeat performance. So you know, I mentioned that I worked in media tech and entertainment, and so I found a few really awesome global congresses and I made sure. I was there every single year in this case, it was MIPCOM and MIPTV in Cannes, France, which is not a hardship trip at all.

And you know, a ton of fun, a lot of red carpets, but that's where the deals got done. And I made sure that. Through the lean times and through the good times. I was always there because it's that consistency. You know, you meet someone once they don't know your fly by night. You're from a country that doesn't have a huge population like Canada.

They don't know that you're. You know, good for your word. And there are always going to be, you know, trust levels, especially if you're doing a really big deal. And so for me, it was just about showing up, like making sure that I had the resources in order to show up. And I had some tricks about that too, that I just want to share with the audience.

So, you know, how could I afford to do that? Well, one of the ways was to be a, a speaker, because when you're a speaker, you get these, you know, very pricey event tickets comp to you. So, in the case of MIPCOM and MIPTV, the price of entry was probably, you know, 2, 500 euros for each Congress, which, you know, is a lot on top of, you know, obviously travel and accommodation and meals and whatnot.

So, you know, I made sure that I had a podium opportunity, a speaking opportunity. And then of course, that led to subsequent business. So there was like a virtuous circle component to that. And, you know, you do have to start small. Maybe, you know, when you first try you're in a small room, you're only speaking with 20 or 30 people over time.

Maybe you're moderating a panel in a sidecar, larger room. And by the end, you're on the big stage. So you know, I would say that international business development really depends on repeat performances for so many reasons in order for you to succeed.

Kelly Kennedy: Well, repetition is key to just about anything, right?

You know, we talk about that because, you know, a lot of people talk on the show about imposter syndrome or, you know, the nerves that we all get, right? And the funny thing is the only way out of imposter syndrome is to do the thing that makes you feel like an imposter. You no longer feel like an imposter anymore, right?

And that's the same thing with absolutely everything. So I think you nailed it.

Catherine Warren: No, then you're just acting the part of the imposter.

Kelly Kennedy: You believe it. That's the important part. Absolutely. So we talked a lot about an international trip. What would be, you know, what are, what is realistic? What is a realistic expectation or goals for a company to set before they take on their first international trip?

Catherine Warren: You know, again, I would say it's identifying dollars and pipeline opportunities and strategic partnership opportunities. So you know, for, for myself, I started out by saying you know, what would be the biggest client or, you know, stable of clients that I could land. With this trip, how long would it realistically take me to land those clients?

And then what would the dollar value of that be? So that that's important for planning, but, but, you know, we're. We do our work for a variety of reasons. It's not always about the dough. It might be about other things like maybe you need a distribution channel or a strategic partner to be a value added reseller in your in your business and maybe you don't have staff.

On the ground in on another continent. And so you need those strategic partnerships. So, you know, really identify those targets get quite granular with them. Like, it can't just be like a sector like, oh, I'm just I'm here to do machine learning conversations. Like, it needs to be much more focused than that. And thats where as a Canadian,

trade commissioners are extremely helpful. So, you know, maybe you don't have the confidence to pick the targets, but you have a notion that they exist in a certain jurisdiction. You've done some research, but you're having trouble identifying the You know, names of the specific clients that you want to target.

So that's where trade commissioners come in. That's what their job is. They want to help with, with trade overseas. They want Canadians to build their businesses and, you know, ultimately bring those revenues back into Canada. So take advantage of that in order to plan your trip. And in terms of, you know, what's realistic, it's.

It's very much you know, a matter of you know, the stage of the business and the type of deal size that you have the capacity to do and deliver on. So that that would be another thing. Like you know, sometimes you'll come away with a great international client, but if you can't do. The fulfillment you know, we, we talked about the follow up, which is one aspect of sales, but then there's also the fulfillment side, right?

It's like, yay. I won the business. Oh no. I won the business. So,

Kelly Kennedy: I've been in those rooms.

Catherine Warren: Oh my gosh. Right. And so, you know, making sure that you can make good on your promises and as a startup, your reputation is everything. And that's really critical. So, you know some of what I did which was possible with the you know, fan building work that I did was we often have the burden of fulfillment back into the clients.

So I'll give you an example. You know, we would be developing digital media strategies for, let's say, a television production company to sell to streaming platforms instead of selling to broadcasters. And so we would work with their same team that in their traditional world would be selling to broadcasters, and we would prepare them.

And their content and their talent and everything for a streaming deal. And so in, in that case, I was not carrying the burden of the fulfillment, except to make sure that their teams could deliver on what I ultimately was promising. So there are a lot of crafty ways that you can work on the fulfillment side, but I just want everyone to understand that.

You know, international business development is not just like money coming at us from another jurisdiction. It still means delivering on the deal.

Kelly Kennedy: Absolutely. Would you recommend that companies start closer to home rather than, you know, getting an opportunity around around the world?

Catherine Warren: You know, I'm of two minds about that.

So you know, that, that's kind of the angry birds model where you know, you develop a property in your home country, it goes to the top of the charts on your you know, Apple store. And then as a result of that, it. Generates interests from all over the world. So, you know, that, that is definitely one model for success and for building an international business is do it well, do it fantastically, do it on the home front, and then the world is your oyster.

I'll give you an example of something we're doing here in Edmonton at Edmonton unlimited that we're very excited about. That uses that model. So we've just launched a program. It's called capital city pilots. And the idea here is that startups from all over Edmonton who have an interest in delivering their products and services to municipal governments, can do it here 1st with the city of Edmonton as their flagship test case client. They can then get the data, the due diligence and the case study from that project and take it to other jurisdictions around the world. That is a very successful pathway to victory, because if you want to sell what you do. In Singapore to you know, a city state or you want to sell it to you know, the city of Atlanta, one of the first things they're going to say is cool.

This looks amazing. How did it work in where you come from? How did it work in Edmonton? And if you say, you know, oh, well, you know, we couldn't get that deal in our own city. They might be very likely to say that sounds like we do not have risk mitigation. That sounds like you know, this is going to be a big lift for us as your client.

We don't want to be. That test case, even though what you're doing sounds amazing. So with, with capital city pilots, we're hoping to unlock that you know, first case flagship client for you to then take around the world. But then of course, you know, getting back to your question, there's another way of doing this, which is you have a product or a service that's going to.

Really change one part of the world. And you are working in partnership with that local jurisdiction and the companies there on the ground, and you're very close to the culture. So, you know, and this, this model works very well. If, if let's say you are. A newcomer, but your network is in your home country.

So let's say you've moved to Edmonton from Nigeria and you really know a lot about what the needs are in the Nigerian marketplace, but you want to grow your business from Edmonton. You might never, in fact. Sell anything even in Canada, and you can still grow an international business that way, and maybe you've chosen to live in Edmonton in my example, because proximity to higher education because of our beautiful blue skies and River Valley or because of our affordability.

So a lot of reasons to you know, consider before you decide in your own mind for yourself. How am I going to be most successful in international business development? And then really leaning into that very specific way that's unique to you and how you work and your impact in your business model.

Kelly Kennedy: Agreed. Agreed. Right. You are uniquely you and no one can do that and that works locally or internationally.

Catherine Warren: That is so true. And one of the things that I'm so proud of our team for doing is we do not give cookie cutter. Advice. Everything is very customized to the individual entrepreneur, to their intellectual property, to their capacity, to the languages they speak, to the home countries that they hail from, all these things, and you get that very custom guidance from

Edmonton Unlimited, including through a network of more than 200 coaches that we have and that we cover the cost for, for eligible businesses.

Kelly Kennedy: Awesome. Yeah. No, this has been amazing. Thank you so much, Catherine, for, for, you know, coming on and just sharing your expertise in international business development, which is not my space at all.

And I'm sure one day it probably will be, but it just hasn't yet in, in my level of career. It will now, it will now. It'll come up and bite me in the butt now.

Catherine Warren: But you're already delivering an international podcast. Sure, yeah, sure. So, so by rights, you are an international business. And maybe you know, in a future podcast or offline, we can talk about how Edmonton Unlimited can help you, Kelly.

Kelly Kennedy: Absolutely. I want to know more. I want to know how we can work together because I'm working with a lot of high level companies in the city and startups as well. Actually, one of them that you're even aware of, we can talk about it offline.

Catherine Warren: Amazing. Congratulations.

Kelly Kennedy: Thank you very much. I want to, I want to put you on the spot just for a second because I get I get a section or a section of our podcast now called community questions where, you know, we have listeners around the world, send their business development questions and to the best of my ability, I will answer them.

However, I also let them know that if I don't have the answer, hopefully I'll, I'll have a guest on that does. And in this case, I recently got a question from somebody in Budapest, Hungary, Roni Patkai, Roni, Roni wrote me and said, Kelly, I was an exchange student in Michigan. I, you know, that was my first international, you know, business, business experience.

And I noticed that there were so many differences from my home country when I got to Michigan, especially with like the kindness of people there, which he said in his home country it's a lot more business. People are a little more. kept to themselves. So it's not quite the same level of extrovert that he got in Michigan.

And one of the things that he had asked me was how do you reach out efficiently to people of different cultures when you're not actually going there? Like if he's just doing international business development, talking to people in different places, do you have any advice for him?

Catherine Warren: Well, first of all, Roni, thank you so much for your question, and I have had the privilege of traveling to Hungary.

Budapest is such an amazing city, and what an incredible place for you to run your business from. You know, I, I do think now, and especially post pandemic doing international business without ever meeting your clients face to face has never been easier. And even though we talked a lot on this podcast about my travel, I would still say that the lion's share of the international business that I have secured has not resulted from the travel.

It has been the result of the kind of persistence and diligence of the connection to the customer and you know, finding creative ways to bring the good intentions, the value proposition, the personal warmth to the relationship. Building that trust and really demonstrating the care that you have for your client and their needs will go such a long way.

And you know, I, I have also had the privilege of meeting people sometimes as many as 10 years after we first started working together, because for whatever reason, we never met in person. We never traveled to the same cities at the same time. And then it's super cool to finally meet someone that you've done remote work with and for so I just give you every encouragement.

I think there's never been a better time to land international business without travel. You know, all of that said, you may choose to travel to, to deepen those bonds.

Kelly Kennedy: Thank you so much, Catherine. That's, that's an amazing answer. And it's a much better one than I could have gave them. So I really, really appreciate it.

It was synchronicity too. That was a very recent question. I always, I find it funny how sync, how, how synchronicities just fall into place on this show where like, what were the odds that we were going to have you on at this exact time? So it was pretty cool.

Catherine Warren: That is so nice. And what a great question for your super duper anniversary podcast.

Kelly Kennedy: Oh boy. I, yeah, it's, it blows my mind. 50 episodes. It's you, you never see it coming. Just one day you wake up and there you are 50 episodes in. So it's cool. I'm looking forward to the next 50.

Catherine Warren: That's great. It's a, it's a super milestone and something to be very proud of.

Kelly Kennedy: Thank you so much, Catherine. I appreciate it.

And you know, that brings us to the end of our show today. I just want to say if If someone wants to get a hold of Edmonton Unlimited, you know, they want some help. They're a local organization. They're looking to grow. They're looking to take on an accelerator or something like that. What is the best way for them to get in touch with Edmonton Unlimited?

Catherine Warren: Well, of course, we have a fantastic website that does a lot of that path finding, so that would be the first port of call, but you are also welcome to connect with me on LinkedIn. I will make sure that all of your answers get a response. Of course, I will try and answer them personally, but I also have the most incredible team with depth of knowledge and bench strength in startups.

And so we're here to serve you. Please reach out, connect with me Catherine Warren on LinkedIn.

Kelly Kennedy: Thank you so much, Catherine, for coming on, for being our expert guest for episode 50, this milestone episode for us. And until next time. We will catch you on the flip side.

Outro: This has been the Business Development Podcast with Kelly Kennedy.

Kelly has 15 years in sales and business development experience within the Alberta oil and gas industry, and founded his own business development firm in 2020. His passion and his specialization is in customer relationship generation. And business development. The show is brought to you by Capital Business Development, your Business Development Specialists.

For more, we invite you to the website @ www.capitalbd.ca. See you next time on the Business Development Podcast.