Think Like a Scientist with Tash Jefferies

Think Like a Scientist with Tash Jefferies

Kelly Kennedy: Welcome to episode 28 of the Business Development Podcast. And on today's episode, we have an amazing entrepreneurial interview with Canadian Serial entrepreneur, Tash Jefferies. She's the founder of multiple companies. She's mentored hundreds of entrepreneurs, and today she's gonna teach us how to think like a scientist.

Stay tuned.

Intro: The great Mark Cuban once said, business happens over years and years. Value is measured in the total upside of a business relationship, not by how much you squeezed out in any one deal, and we couldn't agree more. This is the Business Development podcast based in Edmonton, Alberta, Canada. In broadcasting to the world, you'll get expert business development advice, tips, and experiences, and you'll hear interviews with business owners, CEOs, and business development reps. You'll get actionable advice on how to grow business, brought to you by Capital Business Development, Capitalbd.ca. Let's do it. Welcome to the Business Development Podcast, and now your expert host, Kelly Kennedy.

Kelly Kennedy: Hello! Welcome back to the Business Development Podcast. We are on episode 28, and boy do I have an amazing interview for you today.

We have. Tash Jeffries on today. Serial entrepreneur, total Rockstar. So excited to chat with you today Tash.

Tash is a serial entrepreneur, three time startup founder, Tash Jeffries is a public published author and international speaker. She hails from Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada and makes her second home in Alberta.

She has mentored hundreds of founders around the globe through accelerator programs in Silicon Valley, Canada, MENA, Asia, and Eastern Europe. Her specialties include sales, marketing, developing customer service teams, and founder wellness. Tash holds a bachelor of science degree from Ryerson University and has been an entrepreneur herself for well over a decade.

Tash, pleasure to have you. How are you today?

Tash Jefferies: Kelly, it is so awesome to be here and I'm looking forward to this discussion. It's super well needed, especially here in Canada for anyone in business development, so thank you for inviting me.

Kelly Kennedy: Thanks for coming. Oh man. Okay, so let me just get into where I met Tash.

So Tash is actually a, a friend of Colin Christensen, which is kind of where her name came up. I got invited to this amazing accelerator event by 500 Global. It was called the 500 Global Alberta Accelerator. It was amazing. And guess who was front stage being the mc and just pumping up the crowd. It was you, Tash.

You were just an absolute rockstar. And I knew from the moment that I saw you on stage, That I had to have you on my show. So no, the honor is all mine. It's a pleasure to have you.

Tash Jefferies: And a little bit behind the scenes of that day that you saw me, I actually had, was just like in the middle of stomach flu.

And so for the three days before I could not do anything. We had pitch prep. I was there and actually laying on the back with my founders, I'm like, sorry folks, I'm gonna listen and chime in. When I, and then when I flew back home, I also still had the stomach flu. So I, no idea how I got through that day, like straight up.

Kelly Kennedy: You know, your energy is so contagious. It really is. I was there with my fiance and we were both just in awe. We were, you just pumped up everybody. It was an amazing show. Like, don't get me wrong, the founders were amazing and the, and then the demonstrations were amazing, but frankly we were just pumped to hear you talk cuz you get up there, you'd pump 'em all up.

You were so excited and yeah, it really showed that you tr you know, obviously I know you worked with each one of these founders in individually. Yes. So you had, your heart was in it. Yes. You could tell your heart was in it and yeah, it was amazing. So why don't you start there. Why don't you tell us a little bit about, you're an entrepreneur in residence with 500 Global.

Tell us about that experience. Oh

Tash Jefferies: wow. So I have been an entrepreneur in residence pretty much close to full-time since 2019. And funny story about how I did my first full-time program. So I had been a mentor with 500 Global while I was a founder myself in Silicon Valley in San Francisco, which is how I got involved with them.

And I've just been a mentor. Yeah. Yeah. And, and then it would've been like December of 2018, I got a call about, oh, would you like to come and do this program in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia? And at first I was just supposed to be there for like a week and go in and talk about, yeah, like social media or marketing or sales, whatever they needed.

And then they had an opening where, well, we just had a resident mentor who's pulled out. Would you be interested in going and picking up your life and. Going to Saudi for three and a half months. And I was like, sure. So literally I had five days, not five business days, five days from the point when I said yes to when I got my visa, had to make travel arrangements and literally picked up my life and moved to Saudi for the next three and a half months.

So that's how I got started in, I mean, I've been traveling, I've lived in Seoul I've done virtual programs across Eastern Europe and Asia since then. And so, and, and I was so thrilled when we finally got the program in Canada, which I had been buying for since the very first day I got involved with 500 actually.

I was like, why are we not in Canada? We have amazing founders over here. So now Totally. Yeah. I'm so thrilled that I get to do it in Alberta locally.

Kelly Kennedy: Well, I wanna, yeah, I wanna touch on that because you know, our, our last week's show was actually with Faheem Faheem Khan of Aro Robotic Systems. It's one of our founder.

I was just blown away. I was absolutely blown away by that interview and what they are doing right here in my backyard in Edmonton, Alberta. It was next level, and I'm like, why in the world are we not talking about this? Why are we not talking about these amazing Canadian founders?

Tash Jefferies: But it's great. And so shows like yours, which there are not very many of, are actually helping to get exposure to these amazing founders, which is one of the reasons, to be quite honest, why when you saw me on demo day, I'm so super excited.

It's not just my energy, some of it it is, but I love my work. I, I get to work with amazing founders creating amazing, like literally world changing technologies and helping them bring it to life. And so, How can you not get excited? And I mean, Faheem is an amazing founder and I love, love that podcast, by the way.

So like even getting to see a side of, of founders who I've worked with, and then it's like, oh, here another, like, there was a running joke about Goat Herders. They kept talking about it, which made me think of like the sound of music. And so I was like, oh my gosh. And realizing that it was a real story.

Our founders come from amazing backgrounds and they're doing just amazing things. And so I get to help support founders just like Faheem across the world.

Kelly Kennedy: Yeah, yeah. It that, yeah, that particular podcast just blew me away. Like I, I didn't know Faheem's background before we had that show. Right. Like really, I learn a lot of these backgrounds in these interviews cuz in a lot of the cases we're meeting truly for the very first time.

Like, this is mine in your very first real, real, it is. Conversation, introduction. So it's such, for me, it's such a discovery place. I can't wait to learn about you. And I truly am excited to learn about you because I get to interview such amazing people. Like it's truly a blessing to do what I do here. And yeah, just, you know, Faheem story specifically, just the fact that quite literally, like if you have not heard that story yet, if you were listening in his podcast, pause it.

Go back, listen to Faheem Khan's story.

Tash Jefferies: It's phenomenal. Honestly. He's a great founder. Yeah.

Kelly Kennedy: From a, from a goat herder in Pakistan to a basically a computer scientist, robotics expert.

Tash Jefferies: Like bringing robots to the real world, everywhere coming soon near you. Like seriously,

Kelly Kennedy: it's, it's phenomenal. It's next level.

It's next level. And the fact that like, you know, I'm, I, I've said this to Colin and I'm saying this to you. I'm so inspired by the work that you guys do in helping these founders. It's truly a gift to humanity. I really believe that. I believe that the work you guys are doing is a gift to humanity. And it's a pleasure.

And I hope at some point in my career that I get to do something similar to what you guys are doing, because I truly find it inspirational.

Tash Jefferies: Well, let me, let me give back to you, Kelly, because I know that you're up for an award, a podcasting award. Congrats on that. And let, let's say to you that what you do is super needed and you are giving back because you're giving these amazing people an opportunity to have a voice, to be able to share their story and to have literally thousands, millions, potentially.

And I know it will get to millions. I have, I have, my predictions are pretty good there. And so you're giving these amazing founders a chance to have a platform and let people know their story so that they're just not the hidden story that's next door that nobody knows about, but everyone gets a chance to find out about.

Kelly Kennedy: Yeah. No, thank you, Tash. Thank you. You know, I really, I really enjoy this. I truly love what I'm doing here. There's no question. It's still so early in the process, right? Like sometimes and as a podcaster, you don't see the effect you are making. You know that there's an effect happening, but it's It's kind of a quiet existence, right?

Like we have these conversations, but like the reality is we don't really get to see the outcome of that work. We just have to hope and trust in the process that, that people are finding inspiration. So if you're listening to this show, we really appreciate it when you reach out Absolutely. And you say, Hey, what you guys are doing is great, because you'd be surprised we don't get a lot of feedback, there's not a lot of feedback on the work we do in a podcast.

Tash Jefferies: So, you know what, this actually leads into a part of why I love your show, cuz it's talking about business development. And this is a great place for me to mention to people that, you know, a lot of times, whether you're a founder or an entrepreneur, you get so stuck in the mechanics of how you do things like, oh, I have to like, I know there's a lot of mechanics that goes into creating a podcast, right?

You've gotta find the guest, then you've gotta book it and there's scheduling and then there's like creating the questions and all the prep work and then the editing. There's a lot. But I think the thing that a lot of people miss is that the, your actual energy and people getting that you love what you do mm-hmm.

Has to come through because that is gonna trump any kind of effort that you put into the actual creating. People are gonna hear it. It doesn't have to be perfect, but if people are like, whoa, there's something there the same way that you saw me and was like, oh my gosh, I have to meet this woman. Totally.

Yeah. There's always your ability to throw that in what you're doing. And to me that trumps any kind of like procedural thing that you're trying to do and just like kind of doing business development. No, you gotta love it and it's gonna come across in every step of the way. And if you do that, that magnetic thing, that like something is what other people feel and they gravitate towards and they'll end up finding you and, and somehow they'll say, I get this so much.

I just stumbled across your LinkedIn profile and I had to connect with you, and I'm like, great, there is something there. And there's usually absolutely some nugget of gold. Either I can help them or they help me, and it's always just this, I don't know what it is. I just glanced across your profile and I had to meet you or I had to connect, and that's something is what needs to be included in everything for all of us.

It's an everyday thing.

Kelly Kennedy: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. No, I like, so I talk about this a lot in my show. First off, when I started this podcast, I've made a promise right off day go that I would always be authentic and I would always be real, right? Because I think there's a lot of people get on here and they become a fake person.

Yes. This is exactly how I am in real life. I, I truly am this person.

Tash Jefferies: When I met you, I was like, no. Who is this dude? He is real deal. Love it. So, of course.

Kelly Kennedy: Yeah, because I feel, I feel, I, you know, I did, I, I, if I wanna convey a message, I feel like if I want to convey a message, I need to connect as a human, I need to connect to somebody real.

And the only way to connect to somebody real is if you are truly being authentic with yourself and your listeners. Right? So absolutely from day go, you know, I, I said that I would lay it all out. I would talk about the good, the bad, the ugly, and the amazing. And I'm gonna continue to make that promise to move forward.

Cause I think it's the only way to do this, show it, it really is.

Tash Jefferies: To make it interesting. And again, you know what, this leads up to you. I know when we are prepping for the show, we talked about making sure to talk about social media since that is my jam and what I love. Absolutely. Absolutely. I would love to inspire any of our listeners to be able to come back to social media, but do it in a completely different way.

So one of my rules of thumbs for using social media for business development is, number one, do not make it mechanical. Just like you were saying, if you're gonna come. Come correct. Which means share the good, the bad, and the ugly. Mm-hmm. And if you do not have the ability to do that, I think a lot of us, including myself, would get turned off by social media because everything is always shiny, happy people everywhere.

My life is perfect and it's like, but my life doesn't look like that and so I to try to do is if I cannot portray what's really going on and be authentic about where I'm at mm-hmm. Then I don't share, I don't post because, and that's both. Sure. On the good side and also on the up the, the downside when I'm struggling.

And so I think. To really do social media justice, you have to be willing to come correct and bring your whole self. And if you're not willing to do that, then, then, then you're good. Then stay off and don't use it. And use some other forms, other forms of business development because people are so tired and they're just gonna turn out to turn out of your feed.

They're not gonna listen and they're gonna miss whatever you're talking about anyway, because they're like fake, fake, fake, fake, fake. And like people are tired of it. It's not a way to connect.

Kelly Kennedy: Yeah. And I not only tired of it, I think for an entire generation of young people, it can be very unhealthy.

Right. Oh It's hard on their mental health because, you know what I mean? If they're looking around and all their friends are always, I'm doing amazing and they're struggling, the question starts to go through their head is, am I messed up? Is there something wrong with me?

Tash Jefferies: Listen, my, I have a niece, she's just about to graduate from university and I'm getting ready to go see her.

So shout out to Liz. Awesome. I'm super proud of you. So I know that she has learned of course, because I'm right here with her and she comes to me a lot. Like she takes mental wellness breaks from social media. So if she starts to look at her friends' feeds and she's like, oh my gosh, like, my friends are getting jobs, or they just found this new place, and she starts to think, am I enough?

She has the foresight to be able to say, Nope, tuning it off. So peace out folks. I'm not gonna be on social media for the next like totally couple of weeks until I'm in a space where I can properly handle it. And I think that's one of the skills that we need to teach the next generation how to do so. I mean her ability to do that.

Maybe one day she'll be on your, your podcast cuz she is heading I hope so. Hope she, she's a talented. Hope so young woman. Hope. Yeah.

Kelly Kennedy: Yeah, no, it totally, you know what, and, and I feel like not all social media platforms are created equal. I think that's the other flip side too, right? Like I, I would say I've really leaned into LinkedIn as a business professional and in this podcast, and I've been met with, I kid you not nothing but support, kindness and love from founders and from other entrepreneurs and business owners.

And I feel like it's such a different encouraging atmosphere compared to maybe something like Facebook or Instagram would be.

Tash Jefferies: Right. And so full disclosure I have not been on Facebook in like, it's gotta be at least three years now. Because I've found that to be the situation, right? A lot of tearing down a lot of the shiny, happy people kind of feeling.

And I was just like, I'm not feeling it. But I'm also the same about LinkedIn. However, another tip for those who are listening when it comes to especially business development for your business, I know there's a lot of founders, and I used to fall prey to this as well when I first got up and started, is you'll say, okay, I'm gonna sign up for each account, like all the platforms, TikTok, Instagram, Twitter, whatever it is, which is good to do so that you've got your handle reserved.

But you should literally be focusing, I, I used to say three platforms. Now I'm gonna say two. Find the two where you get that support. Mm-hmm. Where you find it useful. Sure. Where it's actually converting for you. I know people who have been using Facebook and doing Facebook ads and pages, and they still don't get customers from it.

So I always go back and ask, well then what the hell are you working on it for? Because then that's just a time suck. Like make sure you're measuring your metrics and you know, which are the platforms that are driving your revenue and driving your customers and where people actually want what you need.

And then pick two. Yeah. If you're even really good and there's one pick one even better. And so I know even for myself, I used to do Instagram a lot and I used to do this. It was so weird. Yeah. I used to do these Friday dance parties and I had such a big following cuz people would just wanted to in and and I was like, well that's great.

And it was a lot of fun and people are asking for it, but I'm like, yeah, I might do it socially because it's, it was always fun. Like, I miss, I'll get up there and just jam out to some Jay-Z, just go full costume. It was fun for me. But it's not a business development tool for me or a channel for me. So I'm like, well, I'm so happy that you liked it, but.

I might just migrate that over to link LinkedIn. Cause that's my channel, so I'm like, yo. Yeah, yeah. Dance party's coming soon folks, potentially.

Kelly Kennedy: No, totally. And I, and I think you kinda hit the nail on the head, like, as an entrepreneur, we're incredibly busy and your time is incredibly valuable. Like, don't, and I'm not saying that was a waste of time.

I think that's an absolutely amazing use of time because like you said, your mental health is also critical. Oh my gosh. Important. I had so much fun. It was amazing. It be damn good for your mental health. Exactly. But yeah, like, but it's like you have to pick and choose what things you're going to do. So if your thing is a dance party, dance your ass off.

But if you know, but just pick, decide what is gonna make you happy and then what you need to do to grow your business and make sure your things are focused. And like you said, if you're not getting traction on Facebook, That's just, it might be, it might be a waste of time for you. You need to figure out where your customers are.

Absolutely. If your customers aren't on Facebook, that's not the place to be advertising.

Tash Jefferies: That's exactly it. In my, I know for me, I work with startups globally and I help advise startups. Even though they might be on Facebook, I know I need to get them where they're thinking about work, they're thinking about business.

Yes. And they've got those questions that they're asking themselves and it's always nailed in nailed because they're going for, where can I get some answers here? And so I'm actually, you're catching me, Kelly, right out of revamp where I'm actually going back to basics. That's what I love. I love being there to support founders who are trying to kick their startups to the next level and nothing that they're trying is working.

Mm-hmm. And so one of my secret sauces or ninja skills I guess you could call it, is being able to help founders brainstorm and figure out what experiments can they run in their business so that they can. Like either find where their customers are coming from or boost their sales or help with their conversions, or build a better message that reaches their ideal customers, and understanding who that ideal customer for them really is.

Because funny enough, especially what for some reason, it's, it's all founders, but specifically for Canadian founders, I find they get in this train of thought where they built this big, super cool thing, and a lot of times mm-hmm. We're here. It's like Agritech or Cleantech or Ocean Tech. Sure. Then when I start thinking, well, but who's your customer?

Who's gonna pay for this, and why would they need it? They have no idea. And so I'm like, mm-hmm. Oh my gosh. And then you're wondering why we can't get your sales. We need to go back to basics and understand what is the problem that you're solving for who. And who is that person really, so that we can build up an ideal customer profile for you.

Because until you have that, you can't market, you can't figure out business development, you can't find the channels where you're converting people. You just can't. And it's a huge missing piece for, I'd say 90% of founders globally, maybe 95% for Canadian founders, because there's just something that just, there's a disconnect there.

They think, let's just build this awesome thing. And then it's like, well, where's the business behind it?

Kelly Kennedy: So, so just for clarification, we basically have a product in search of a problem instead of a problem in search of a product.

Tash Jefferies: 1000000%. And that's usually the case where I find a lot of founders. And so to get them to flip the script and come from the other direction, which is, well, what's the problem that you're solving?

It is an eye-opener because most of them have not even thought of it like that. Because I'm like, yeah, you could have the most amazing solution ever. It is game. It is gonna cut down greenhouse gases. Eliminate waste. Yeah. But if you can't tell me who's gonna buy it, who's gonna pay for it, then we don't have a business and there's not much we can do, but pretty tough.

We can actually create experiments, very small experiments. So one of the things that I live by is experimentation for Founders, which is, yeah, what can we do in the span of a week where we can get some kind of feedback or signal from the market as to whether or not they want it. And it's so funny, most founders understanding and breaking down a business in those small pieces is a game changer, which is why I teach it.

Yeah. Because it's, it's a different way of looking at your business, but it could potentially save you lots of sleepless nights and lots of times where you hit like zero in your bank account and don't know why. And all of these other struggles that founders deal with all because totally we're taking a scientific approach.

And for years, quite honestly, because I've had, I don't know, at least seven different careers since I graduated from school with that science and chemistry background. And so I kind of leave finally feel like it came back full circle in that I get to go back to my basics of what I loved for years, since I was like literally three years old.

I wanted to be a scientist, but I get to now incorporate that scientific, experimental method back into the work that I do. So it's pretty cool.

Kelly Kennedy: Yeah, no abs. Absolutely. And actually, so I've had at this point, three entrepreneurial experts yourself calling Christensen and Dale Shob. And yeah, all of them, all of you have said the exact same thing.

You want, you want to test your idea in a way that you can fail quickly instead of failing at the point that you've had, you know, millions of dollars in invested.

Yeah, great advice. That's amazing advice.

Tash Jefferies: Oh my gosh, yes.

Kelly Kennedy: Oh my goodness. So Tash, I wanna take us back to the beginning. You know, like you've been an entrepreneur for an incredibly long time. I have a lot of entrepreneurs listening to this show who were either, they have a great idea and they're on the fence about taking that jump.

They have a great job too. And I think that's a lot of the challenges a lot of entrepreneurs have is they have an amazing job they love, but they have this amazing idea that is, is driving them to take that leap. But there, there's some fear, there's some stuff involved there. First off, First off, I wanna, I wanna ask you for those people, do you have some words for those people that are on the fence?

And then, and then second off, I would like you to take us back to the beginning of Tash Jefferies and what it was like to found that company for you.

Tash Jefferies: Oh boy. Oh boy. So I think my advice to those people who are on the fence about whether or not they take this big leap, so the first thing I would say is, it is super important to have a, a vision or goal or something that you are like, you're hungry for.

I always say go back to mm-hmm. What are you hungry for? Because at the end of the day, I can tell you, even for myself, I'm so hungry for, to be successful and to help as many founders across the globe as I can. And so, if anything kept me up at night, it is that. But it's a good thing. Many times we're kept up at night from, you know, money stresses or family stresses or what have you.

Totally. But I'm kept up by an extremely motivating idea, which is how do I get to more founders? Yeah. Who I can help either succeed really quickly or fail really quickly so that they can get back up and succeed at something else really quickly. Cuz that's how I view entrepreneurship. It's true, right?

You kinda gotta do it. There is a success in there, but there's probably gonna be a lot of fa failures, just like I've experienced myself, right? So how, yeah, what's that? What's that driving thing that like literally keeps you up at night and are you hungry for it? Because it's the hunger that keeps you going.

But then the second big thing, and I don't think enough founders, including myself once upon a time thought about this, but. What's my engine for really driving revenue so that I can sustain myself because I, yeah. You know, before I found my tribe through 500 and all the amazing founders that I get to work with, I was amongst a different tribe of some broke ass founders who were hungry, but they couldn't figure out like, you know what I'm saying?

Like, but they, they were broke and they couldn't afford anything and they, they had no lifestyle and they were subsisting. And I was like, at one point I was like, no, I think I'm gonna go back and do something else, build up my wealth a little bit here, and then give another pick at the can. And thank goodness I did, because the next time I started my one of my startups which was called Higher Kind, I was a co-founder of Higher Kind, based in San Francisco.

It was HR tech company. I realized that we could close deals, I could close deals like nobody's business because we found a problem that needed to be solved by companies and we could drive revenue. And so we ended up driving the growth in our startup through customers. Customers were closing deals.

They wanted the solution that we had at the time. We were matching tech companies who were looking for underrepresented talent, tech talent to be able to come to the right company. And so we found, and it was a huge problem. Quite honestly, it's still a big problem. Maybe one day I'll start up diverse again, which is my third startup and actually finished the technology.

But we found a problem that needed to be solved. We found our ideal customer profiles, and then we literally just solved that problem for them. We were introducing them to candidates that they were looking for, which they would then, you know, hire. And so, I would say like know where your revenue is coming from so that you can support your lifestyle because a broke ass entrepreneur is not motivating anybody else.

But when you have your life together and you're able to, yes, like take care of the basics, right? Like then you can go out there and continue to be yourself and like those stressors are now off your plates that you can be your best and shine.

Kelly Kennedy: Totally, totally. No, and, and you know, I, I completely agree with that.

It's real, and I think it's really hard to stay motivated if you're trying to figure out where your food and your rent's coming from the next week.

Tash Jefferies: It's, it's, it's impossible. And I was like, yo, I'm out. I mean, just for everyone who's on this podcast, I talk about it quite openly in Halifax here. I'm from the north end of Halifax.

It's the hood beautiful place. And you know what I'm saying? It's, it's, but it's where. You know, there's usually not a lot of hope given to people in my community. And one of the reasons really why I come back and I give back to my community a lot's cuz I'm like, don't believe that hype. You can do whatever you wanna do.

I'm like mm-hmm. You know, from this neighborhood. And I now get to travel the world and I make good money and I own my own home. And I've achieved a lot of the basics that they usually try to say you can't do if you come from this particular area. And I'm like, no, don't believe you do anything.

Kelly Kennedy: That my mind, oh yeah, that blows my mind.

Yeah. Okay. So I, so we went Halifax for the first time last year. I'd never been to the East Coast, so that was my first trip to the east coast of Canada. And I was instantly in love. I was in love. What a, I would've never thought, like, just, just in this conversation here, that that's where you were gonna go with it.

Oh yeah. Just from my experience in Halifax, like, it, it looks like such just a beautiful it's got amazing old architecture. It's got amazing history. It's right on the Port. It does. I couldn't imagine that there's a part of Halifax that that would be disadvantaged.

Tash Jefferies: Well, there's multiple parts by the way, and also a little nugget.

So this is also a little history lesson for those of you who are listening. My lineage and my mom was actually born in Africville. Which is one of the very few indigenous black communities in all of Canada. And so, wow. That's also in the north end. And again, There's a lot of history within this community, but there's also this angst, there's just a lot of cultural things that go on in Halifax that if you're not from here, you don't hear about and you don't see.

It's kind of like in the background. Yes. But I can tell you there's also some frustrations. There's some things that are like historically that have happened and like our entire community got gentrified, so everybody owned their land in Africville. We all, all of the families there got shipped off to these areas.

The north end to Mulgrave Park is another area. There's another one in Fairview. All these public public housing projects. And so there's a lot of history that's attached there. And so the energy in, for people who are from here, there's a lot of stigmas that most people from here have to overcome.

Also, another reason why I travel, because no one's aware of that stigma. If I go out west or if I go to Saudi or I go to Egypt, nobody has any idea.

Kelly Kennedy: Don't get me wrong. We have, we have our, we have our challenges out this way too. No question. I know question, right? We deal with a lot everywhere. But yeah, it really is unknown, I think, and especially if you're a visitor to a place like Halifax.

You wouldn't. You wouldn't.

Tash Jefferies: You would never at all. I'll let you know someone who's there. Exactly. But on the upside of that, my contribution, I feel it greater because I now get to come back and talk to young people and be present in local communities and let them know I'm right from here. Like I get called into a lot of events on the East Coast and they're like, what?

You're from here? How do we not know about you? And I'm like, well, I'm here. I don't hide. I come back home i am a proud Blue Noser and Nova Scotian.

Kelly Kennedy: Yeah, for sure. For sure. Yeah. Not true, but you know, fairness in your community. You know, how many people do you really know in your community? I think there's a lot of communities that you don't even know your neighbor.

Like that's just the reality of unfortunately, the world that we live in. And it's really, it's too bad because I think a lot of it stems out of fear and it's an irrational fear.

Tash Jefferies: Absolutely. And you know what, this goes back to the whole again, cuz I love to bring it back to the business development side because that's what I'm hoping we give some insights for today.

And I think one of the biggest pieces of business development that all of us need to be aware of is that, In order for you to do well, you have to exist outside of fear. Not to say that you don't have them, we all have them, but I mean, anyone who's ever met me knows that my hair is big. I always tell everybody, just search for Tash and look for the hair.

You can like me. And it's literally, I've never had somebody come back and say, I couldn't find you. So I mean, no. And I wear bright colors everywhere I go. I have bright F nails, I've got a bright jacket on. If you're listening on a podcast, like I wear bright colors and I'm known for that. Right? And it's because I have no fear with like standing out, like coloring outside of the lines and just being, yeah, who I am and authentic to myself.

And sometimes that means I'm, I'm the loudest one in the room. And I don't know if that's because I'm only five feet tall or what that is, but I love to make sure that I'm fully communicating and I do it my own way. It's not to say that everybody has to have a style, but. If you're not afraid to not be afraid, yeah, then you're gonna miss the mark.

And you have to be willing to do it with your own personal brand and develop your style and be memorable. Ultimately, you gotta be memorable and yeah, unfortunately it's the case. I'm super friendly. Any, like, I have strangers who talk to me all the time and I talk back to almost all of them, and that is a part of my brand.

Like I'm not afraid of people. I think people are fascinating and honestly, it's the best thing you can have for business development. Nothing worse than going to an event and trying to find some customers and you're afraid to open your mouth, like absolutely talk to people. It's not, it's, it's scary, but the more you do it, the less scary it becomes.

Kelly Kennedy: Yeah, totally. And, and first off, let me just say, you may be five feet tall, but you speak like you're 15 feet tall.

Tash Jefferies: That amazing. People who I've known for years. And then I finally meet and they're like, where's the rest of you?

Kelly Kennedy: Yeah. And then part two to that is I actually have an entire show on on performance anxiety and stage fright. And the reason being is that I think people look at a guy like me who's been in business development now for well over 10 years, been in sales for over 15 years. And they say, well, you can't be afraid of any of these meetings.

And I'm like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. I still get nerves at almost every meeting. I had nerves before this meeting with Tash. Like, like, I get nerves. I, I actually fight a little bit of anxiety. Like I, I've struggled with it most of my life, especially with, with speaking with other people or having these types of interviews or having these types of meetings.

You know, I've, you know, I've been in a business where I've been fortunate enough to meet with some pretty high level people who can be pretty intimidating sometimes. Of course it's right. But Kelly, you know, we do it anyway.

Tash Jefferies: Nerves are good and this is how, yeah. I, you know, think of this the day you met me when I was hosting our 500 global demo day.

I was nervous, by the way, all of the intros for anyone who watches the shows, cuz I've done it now for the past three years or the past three batches. Like I write all the intros, but then I free ball it on the day of. So it's like literally just off the cuff because I know my founders, but like, I'm nervous as hell.

I'm sweaty boy. That's why I keep a jacket on because other than that, you'd see pit stains and I'd be sweating like, it's a, it's very nervous. But to me, if you don't have that little bit of nerves, number one, how are you getting amped up? Nerves means you care. You put that extra little oomph into it and you give, you go for it.

You're like, yeah, you're nervous. There's a huge room full of people all looking at you. Or even in an, you know, in a business meeting with someone who you've been trying to get to, someone who's got cloud, who's, you know very well known if you don't have a little bit of nerves. Then it means you don't, maybe you don't care because you should.

It's an opportunity. Yeah. And you should crush it. And I always teach founders to utilize that little bit of nervous energy to just like, bring your a game, bring it, go for it. You got this.

Kelly Kennedy: Like, yeah, you're, you're a hundred percent on point. You're a hundred percent on point. I just think, I think that society has tried to teach us that it's not normal.

Or like, like you, you're, oh, you get nerves though. Like that's, you know, that's just you, you know, you're just a wuss or whatever. No, that's not the case. And I, I hope that, that's a huge takeaway from the show today is that I don't care who you are, you are going to get nerves, or most likely you're going to get nerves dealing with, with a high level meeting or with a, with a stage presentation or any type of public speaking event.

And it is completely normal. It's completely okay. There is nothing wrong with you.

Tash Jefferies: So, Kelly, let me go back and this is a perfect time. 1000000% by the way the perfect time to have our founders really understand that. Common sense is uncommon. My mother, God bless her soul, she used to tell me this all the time, and she was a stickler.

I'm, I would say the majority of my success in business is due to my mom, because she would always tell me like, yeah, everybody else might be saying this is the way, but what's your experience? How do you feel when you're doing it? Mm-hmm. What makes sense to you? And it, it's the reason why I always go back to the results.

Is it working for you? Is, you know, everyone telling you that you're not supposed to have nerves when then you have nerves. Like how about those people who say they don't have nerves? Are they killing it? Are they crushing it? Do you believe them? Because I guarantee even those people who are online saying, oh, I don't get nerves guaranteed that they do, they just stay saying it because it's part of this facade, again, this shiny happy people syndrome, right?

It's like, nah, think about it. Nerves is a part of life, right? Fear is a part of life, but there's also another part which you have to expand yourself beyond, which is to say, well, that's nice. Fear is there, nerves is there, but what do I want? Yeah. And what do I need to do to get there? And just go for it.

And just be like, okay, I'm gonna just jump all in then and just do this. And to me, the true founders are the ones who are willing to see that and say, Nope, I'm just going for it. So, You know, feel free to come along, but I'm going on this ride. Yeah,

Kelly Kennedy: absolutely. And I think one of the important things, and one of the things I want you to take away is that I've never been in, in some type of public speech or some type of meeting that those nerves did not subside after about a minute or two minutes.

So just remember like how you're feeling in a moment. If you're like terrified, if you're like really nervous, just recognize that it will subside, it will go away once you start. It's, I think, I think in some ways it's the focus on the nerves that give it power. And when suddenly you're no longer focused on them, you're focused on the discussion, you're focused on making a connection or to maybe pump up a crowd in your case.

They tend to subside. It's like you, you'd stop looking at 'em and they go away.

Tash Jefferies: Well, and also I think that's a credit to those who do it well because totally agree with you as well. Once you get over that initial, oh my gosh, I'm going to be in front of all of these people, and you get up there and you just then say, Nope, I'm gonna be me.

I'm gonna give er, then the energy will return back to you. If you give the energy, and this is the same with business development as well, if you give out that energy, People will give it right back. And you've been in one of the crowds for, you know, one of the events that I've done. Yeah. I work with everyone.

That energy that's in the room, I make sure people get pumped up and yes, they can't say, well I didn't bring it cuz I bring it and then they wanna bring it and they give it right back. Which means the rest of totally of it ends up becoming so much fun because they're into it. There's audience participation.

Yeah. I can see the smiles. Yes. The laughs And you know, I crack corny jokes cuz that's what I do and it's like, and then you, you forget about the nerves. Once that happens then, then you're just in it and like, yeah, let's bring it. People are feeling it and it's, it amplifies the energy and then you just see this expansion I think really.

Totally. That's all that people want. Period. Bringing it back to business development, we have this concept that we do, that we teach in our programs called Jobs to Be Done, which is. If your customer wants your solution because they're trying to get to an end state or a better state, what's that better state that you're trying to get them to?

Mm-hmm. And if you can understand what that is, then you can figure out how to get them there. And it's honestly, it's no different than being a public speaker, right? Most of the times people wanna come so that they can be energized, they can be inspired, they have good stories, they're entertained. So let's just say they wanna be entertained.

If you can give them that sense of entertainment, where they're having a good time, they hear some corny jokes, they hear some great stories about founders, and at the end of the night they're like, I couldn't imagine being anywhere else tonight. Then your job is done. Success. Yeah. They're gonna come back to the next event or whatever it is they're going to do.

And so I think thinking of that expansion, I like to think of it as expansion. Most people want that. And if you are able to bring that for them, You got them, you got them hooked. They're like, yo, this, this is amazing. Okay. I want more.

Kelly Kennedy: Yeah. I, I always like to say that it, like, if you have a product that people need, it's not really that hard to sell it.

Like that tends to be the reality. True. If you can demonstrate the value that your product or service will bring to their company and say, Hey, today you're doing this, but if you bring our product, you'll be doing this and, and they can see it. That's the problem is that you need to demo, you need to demonstrate it and show it in a way that their wheels and their head can spin and they can see, you know what, a hundred percent I see the value.

Absolutely. Then if you can deliver on that value, it's a no-brainer. They're just gonna keep coming back.

Tash Jefferies: That's exactly it. And then you get testimonials and so, I mean, absolutely. The, the, to me, the testimonials is also the other piece of the business development train to make sure that you, like you are delivering results to people who then say that they've got these results.

And so that helps bring in other customers and continues Yeah. That train for you. And so one of the best pieces of feedback that I could get as an advisor and mentor is a talk to founder. Sometimes very first call, very similar to us on the first time. Usually my first call with a founder is 15 to 30 minutes.

But even in 15 minutes I get feedback, like I've got more from this 15 minute call that I have for like 2, 3, 5 hour calls with other mentors. Like, you are unbelievable. And I'm, and I say it all the time because it is true. I don't have to say it. These are my founders who come to me and tell me. Like absolutely they get value in understanding a little bit more about their business or how to reach their customers.

And I have an ability to, because I've worked with so many now to be able to understand the problem, give them tactical solutions that they can apply, like literally. As soon as we get off the call. And so I don't have to say it anymore cuz my founders say it for me and they refer other founders to me.

So I'm like, okay, this is like, what else do I need here from a founder? Yeah. I don't have to say it to you anymore.

Kelly Kennedy: Totally, totally. Yeah. And that's something I wanna kind of take us into the next spot of the show is I really want to kind of touch on what are some of the tactics that you've utilized with not only your own business, but with your founder's business to kind of help them market their companies out to the world or to make those connections.

Maybe tell us a little bit about what, what's worked well for you and maybe what hasn't worked as well.

Tash Jefferies: Got it. So let me start with what hasn't worked well because I think a lot of founders get into this frame of mind, which is, let's just do the pr, let's get press releases, let's try to get published on Fortune or Inc.

Or, you know, any of these other magazines. And so that, that visibility is going to get us customers. Save your time, save your money. Stop, do, stop chasing down rabbit holes. My founders also know there's a concept that I talk about, which is called the yellow brick road, which is you have to take your customers down, literally just one step in front of the other.

Very simple. Don't make things complicated. They make binary choices the whole way around. That's how you should have your sales cycle. So one of the best things that I could, would say for founders is at the very beginning, or even entrepreneurs at the very beginning of your business, don't be afraid to call people.

Call, call. Find a list of who you think are your potential customers, and literally call them with the offer. But you said it earlier, Kelly, which is, you know, the problem that you solve for. So talk to them. Get into a conversation. Ask them if they're facing this challenge. You know, what have they tried to get over it, and what would it look like if they got that solved for them?

And then offer a solution. It's not, it's not really rocket science, but you need to not be afraid to talk to people. And I would say the very first basis of before you start looking at marketing campaigns and Facebook, pick up a phone and call or get on a Zoom call and talk to your customers, because that's the easiest way to understand whether, you know, this is something that you should be following, or if people even want this solution.

Yeah. In many cases you might find out that this is a nice to have, this isn't a, I need it. This isn't a painkiller, but it's a vitamin. It's like I could take it, I could could take it or leave it. Absolutely. Talk to people. Don't be afraid to talk to people early on, and don't be afraid about having a perfect message.

Start with what you have. Yeah. And then what's gonna happen is through those conversations, you're gonna learn more about what works, what are the right questions you should be asking, and you will tailor it as you go. But you gotta, you gotta talk to people and not be afraid to cold call. Nailed it. Cold calling is the most underutilized skill,

especially for millennials and younger. Mm-hmm. Because for someone of my generation, I'm a lot older than I look or I sound, but like we were taught the basics of cold calling. It's the first sales tool we had. Oh, I'll give a few tips because these are some resources that our business development folks would love.

They're old school, but they, they still work. Totally. Zig Ziegler, Bryan Tracy, Earl Nightingale. When I was starting my sales career and working in management consulting, those were the three gurus that I went to and their methods, it's all about like breaking the ice, how to talk to people, making sure like you talk to enough people so that you know whether or not it works.

And also the confidence behind doing that. Getting confident about having something and not being afraid. Again, going beyond your fear and having the confidence to know that you have something that can potentially help them. And so like the best advice I would give to any founders and I, I force all of my founders to do that.

If they don't like calls and they're afraid of that, I force 'em to do that and then tell me what happens.

Kelly Kennedy: Yeah, and I'm gonna speak to that because you know, you talked about the message not being perfect. Let me tell you, every single new client I get, the message is not perfect at first. It takes me multiple rounds of figuring out what that message is, learning more about their company.

My message gets better and better and better the longer that I'm with that client because I better understand the service. The speech itself starts to become automated in my brain. Cuz I've done it so many times. So don't feel bad if the first couple cold calls are, heck, maybe the first hundred cold calls you make suck.

Maybe they do, but guess what? That 100 and One, that one's gonna kill it. So, It's just, it's just being brave enough to pick up the phone. And I know it's scary. Believe me, I know it's scary. Like I'm a millennial. I'm 34. I still, I still struggle some days to pick up my phone.

Tash Jefferies: You're youngin and you make calls.

Kudos.

Kelly Kennedy: Yeah. I make a lot of calls. I I, I follow an 80 20 rule. I feel I follow an 80% active marketing, which is direct emails, direct phone calls to about a 20% passive, which is the social side.

Tash Jefferies: And honestly, Kelly, you've, you've hit the nail on the head. That's exactly what every entrepreneur, every founder should be doing.

And it's what works, right? Everything else you're leaving to chance. And I tell founders, you're gonna leave the money that comes in your pocket or your ability to grow your tech and your startup to chance. Uhuh get to people. Talk to people. Don't be afraid to talk to people. And honestly, kudos to you for doing that because it is the, the, the shore fire way to be able to grow a business the more you're able to get over those fears and not be perfect.

Yeah. I used to be a, a perfectionist, but I have not been a recovering perfectionist for a couple decades now. I let that go real early.

Kelly Kennedy: I'm very much still in recovery .

Tash Jefferies: And it's all good. Being aware it's half the battle. It's all good.

Kelly Kennedy: Yeah. Yeah. I hate failing Tasha. You know? I really do. And I know.

It's like, I know. It's like, oh, we all have to fail. It's like, nah, I don't wanna, I wanna bust my ass.

Tash Jefferies: I have, I have learned, and this is another thing, we actually teach this a lot too. I've learned to actually embrace failure, cuz I can tell you Yeah. I, again, I've been through so many careers and learned so much.

But I can tell you, unless I failed doing what I was doing, I would never, literally never be doing the work that I am doing now. Yes. And it all became, I, I truly believe that like all of the failures led me to this position where now I have a career that I love. Totally. I have a life that I love. Yeah. If you were to ask me when I was five, cuz again, I had completely different ideas of how my life is gonna turn out.

You know, I wanted lots of kids, I, you know, wanted to be a scientist and all these other things and I'm like, my life looks nothing like that now. Like, but I think. I have so much freedom and I have so much excitement, like I'm on an adventure cuz I never know where any of my programs are going to be, with the exception of Alberta.

Like this is a three year program. But other than that, like I don't know where I'm gonna be any given week where I don't need to Cairo excuse me, Cairo, I'm still looking forward to this trip. But like other than that, I never know like what's gonna happen next and where my journey is going to land. And I'm telling you, I would not trade any of what I'm doing now for the world.

Kelly Kennedy: Yeah. And you know what? Yeah. I've talked with a couple founders now about synchronicity. Yeah. Both Colin and Dale chatted about synchronicity and, and I had to type in because I, I feel like, yeah, it's like all, all choices I made in my life, all paths led here. I could not do what I'm doing today if I had not done all the things I did in my past.

And it's so funny cause what I was talking about in that synchronicity side is that for me it's felt like a lot of the pieces that just needed to fall into place for these things to happen really did the opportunities presented themselves. And I didn't say no, things like that, but it's like, in some ways sometimes I just feel like very fortunate and very lucky.

And I think there's like, there's a synchronicity that happens for each and every one of us that takes us to down the path that we're supposed to end up on.

Tash Jefferies: Absolutely. And I think also something that all founders and entrepreneurs need to be aware of, and I know I know you asked a question of what would you go back and like, you know, tell your younger self. And my answer when I get asked this, cuz I speak a lot and I always say I wouldn't tell them nothing. And the reason why is that that one slight change would change the entire traject trajectory of my life. Sure. And I think that all my failures, all my successes, everything was meant to be how it is now and for me to fully enjoy.

Like anyone who knows me, knows that I'm joyous. I love my life. There are challenges which I share too. Like I, I just, I'm, I'm not fearful of saying it. But I love my life and I. I would not have the life that I have now if I went back and I'd change a single thing. And so I've learned to just embrace this and I, you know, I know lots of motivational channels talk about, oh, you know, regrets.

I have chosen to live a life with no regrets. Okay. So, mm-hmm. My life went in a way where, you know, I've had a few failed marriages. Absolutely. Okay. Cuz now I have a partner that I love and I can't do without, and I wouldn't have learned that unless I went through it. I don't have kids, but that means I can pick up and go anywhere I want.

Within the span of however long and I get to do what I love, which is my legacy for me is all the startups that I get to work with globally and help them to make this world a better place for my nieces, for my nephews, yeah. For everybody else's kids too. So I'm like, absolutely. I'm, I'm, I'm good.

Like, don't cry for me. I'm good.

Kelly Kennedy: Well, I, you know what, one of the sad, or like, maybe the things that's a little bit unfortunate about being human is, is that someone like you is going to change the lives of millions and millions of people through, through your entrepreneurship and, and through and through your founders.

And it's too bad that we just don't get to see our impact in the world sometimes, because the reality is, I think each and every one of us would be blown away by how much the little things or the things that seem so trivial to you impact the world as a whole.

Tash Jefferies: So I would say, first of all, thank you for saying that Kelly.

Cuz there, for those of us who do this kind of work, our impact is there. But I think that's also another piece of why I consider myself super, super lucky. I've worked with, I think that number is actually way over 300 now, but I've worked with more than 300 founders, like a lot. I'm talking about doing programs with like really getting to know their business or startups and more importantly know their families.

We partied together, we laughed together, we've cried together. And that the number of founders that I say in touch with since I first started doing this work is super, super high. It's gotta be over 80%. Wow. And so for me, I witness, I get to witness like things that I've done and watch my founders grow. I have founders who started out.

I saw them raise their seed round. I saw them raise their series A round. Some of them are actually in the process of going to series B. Like I get to witness like that little spark and like see a little piece of what I feel like I could have contributed to in their success. And I, I know about it cuz I keep in touch with them.

Like literally I have a global family. It's unreal. And so it's another thing that keeps me motivated to keep reaching more cuz I can see the impact and a lot of people. You know, for what they do, might not see that. I know a lot of teachers, for instance, don't get to see the impact, but I am super blessed and lucky in that I get to see it and hear about it and follow up and see.

Because the startup life is also one where if you're gonna be successful, that success can happen pretty quick. And so you get to be there for the ride and don't you get to see it. It's a rollercoaster. It's a rollercoaster, but it's also like when you see it happen and you're like one of your founders, you're just seeing and there's an article pops up and they're like, just a heads up.

This is coming out today.

Kelly Kennedy: That's amazing. Yeah, yeah. Oh man. Yeah, I totally get what you're saying. And it's too bad. And I think a lot of pe I think the education sector is one that is very undervalued in that way. And I wish that, I wish that more educators could see, I, you know, I have a fiance who works in education. I know that that's one of the things that is a struggle sometimes it's hard to see the outcomes of the efforts you're doing.

You know, you're making an immense effort, but you can't see what's happening. And I think that it's very, it's too bad that we haven't found a better way to show educators how they're working.

Tash Jefferies: So, hold on. We're gonna do this. We're gonna do a little experiment here in real time, Kelly. So I'm gonna put a challenge out to all of your listeners.

If you ever had a teacher who made a profound impact on your life, like made you see things differently, made you get an interest for something, like literally, see if you can find them on Facebook or LinkedIn and just reach out and send them a note. And even if the, it's, so I'll give an example of why this matters to me.

So one of my early lives, I was starting out in politics. I ended up working on an NDP campaign in Halifax with Alexa McDonough. Yeah. Unfortunately she passed away. But what I ended up doing was I ended up finding her son and reaching out and saying, listen, I need to let you know the impact your mom had on my life.

Wow. And I wouldn't be doing what I'm doing now if it wasn't for her. And like literally he sent that message and he was like, do you mind if I share this with our entire family? And I was like, yes, please do. I had a chance to tell her like before she ended up getting sick, but that was a long time ago and she didn't see what I'm doing now.

But there's still ways for you to go and send that message to their loved ones, their family. She's a great, and it's such a powerful moment. I have, I have one of my music teachers. I'm, I cannot sing a lick, but I do play the piano and play the guitar. So I have music within me. Awesome. And so I still keep in touch with.

Mrs. Rooney, if you ever hear this podcast, I know I owe you coffee. And so it's like, it's super important. She was one of my favorite teachers and like she knows it cause I still stay connected. So it's important for us to be able to like close that loop. And

even in business development, how it goes is, remember those small things. You had said it earlier, like those small things all add up in a person's life. And that's something also my mom taught me. Like, be so appreciative of those small wins, those small things, those small things that make you happy. Like don't take those things for granted.

And I know without a shadow of a doubt, I don't. I see sunshine. It's a bright, beautiful day. I'm good. Blue sky, I'm happy. It'll make me smile. And yeah, I think all of us need to have that. Like, just take that time every day. Not once a week, not once a month. Every day, every hour. If you can do it even better.

Kelly Kennedy: Yeah, no, totally. And and I think, I just wanna touch on that briefly is also celebrate the wins. And I'm gonna be honest, I'm horrible for this and I need to get better at it. But some advice that was given to me was celebrate the wins. Because I think as like a founder and entrepreneur, a business owner, you're, you're so busy like you really are.

You got a thousand things to do, you'll get a win and it'll be like, great, I did that. But you won't celebrate it. And I think if you can find time to celebrate those little wins with your family, with yourself, however you want to do that, you should. I think you should, because I think a lot of good things happen.

And I think if you don't point them out, It's easy to look at all the negative things that are happening. If you don't celebrate the good ones.

Tash Jefferies: 1000000%. Kelly, and I'm gonna give an example. So anyone who's ever worked with me knows that I'm the energizer bunny. Like literally, it could be a long day, it could be a 14 hour day.

I will end off on the same high note that I started my day and I energize people. I get in, I get people pumped up, get them smiling, get them ready to start their day. But I know without a shadow of a doubt, the reason I am like that, and I do that, is because, you know, there's a lot of founders who like, don't celebrate.

I celebrate any, everything. Listen, I get my latte done correctly with a foam and there's a little heart on it. I celebrate, I'm celebrating all day. Little wins. I get to zero inbox and I've answered all my inbox messages and I have none left. I'm celebrating yo who wants, you know, who wants lunch?

I got you.

If, if, if we as founders, as entrepreneurs don't take the time to fill up our own cup, who the hell is gonna do it for us? And so I always tell entrepreneurs, you have to make time for celebrating. And again, they might seem so, Minor in minuscule and small. Like for instance, I had a founder who ended up well this happens a lot, but an example is like a founder will have to get on the phone with an irate customer and then they end up turning that customer around and then they end up upgrading them to a whole different higher tier on their plan and they end up finding out a lot of information about what can make their product better.

And I keep saying celebrate it. Take time and be like, yo, first of all, we just up upsold a customer who could have just stopped and you could have lost every revenue all together, like celebrate that and. They're giving you help to make what you do even better. Celebrate that. Stop complaining that you have to make this call to a customer.

Look forward to those calls with the customers, cuz they're probably gonna make what you do even better. And so, totally like those kinds of things of finding those little wins that you have in your day. I take, we are constantly experimenting and when we create programming, what's gonna get founders to take it on even more so that they apply it to their business.

And if I end up, like the other day, I experimented with a workshop where I created like fake deliverables for a well known company. So I took a company like Twitter and said, listen, we need to take it from a thousand users to 2000 users, create a set of experiments. And the people who did the experiment were like, this was the best like lesson workshop I've done in years.

And it was just a quick thought like, well maybe this would be fun for people. Totally celebrated. I'm like, yo, I'm taking this back. I'm gonna use this in my other workshops now. And so we need to take those small little, what might be insignificant wins and turn it into a big win and let it fill up your cup, get your energy back.

Kelly Kennedy: Okay. I wanna stay on the experiment side cause I think you got something here. Talk to our, talk to our new entrepreneurs, our founders. How, how, how to think like a scientist. How can they, how can they use experiments to test theories or to criti use critical thinking? What are some, can you, can you use your scientific theory to help them?

Tash Jefferies: Kelly, for those of you online who are just listening to my voice, I'm doing like fist pump cuz I'm excited. Anytime I get to bring science into something, I get excited. So

Kelly Kennedy: Absolutely. You've got sweet dance going!

Tash Jefferies: So funny. Love it. So first of all, every founder, entrepreneur, if you're listening this, you have to become like a scientist when it comes to thinking about the results in your business.

So what I would say is experimentation mode. Take it on. What this means is every week, literally seven days, you should be running an experiment. That is gonna impact one metric that matters to your business. Now, there's a very, there's a process that we usually take founders through to understand what's that metric, but that metric should be tied ultimately to your revenue, to your number of customers, to the usage of your products, something.

But whatever that metric is, everybody on your team should be focused around testing for seven days. That experiment that you run to test, it should be able to be up and running couple hours max. Which means if you are putting together an experiment to test something in your business, and it takes two days, hell, if it takes one day to put together, it's not an experiment.

Stop, break it down into something even smaller, and you need to be able to measure the results. What do you think is gonna happen? How is it gonna drive very specifically in actual numbers, whether it's your revenue, your number of customers, the amount of usage. And then once that seven day period is up, you take a look at what you thought was gonna happen.

You compare it to what actually happened, and then you take a look at that experiment and see is this something that we're gonna continue to use? Or did it fail and that we need to look at something else? Mm-hmm. Every single week, everybody in your startup or your your business should be looking at something that goes with that same kind of cadence.

You should not be working on experiments in your business that take more than, you know, a couple hours to put together and to execute.

Kelly Kennedy: Is there a KPI model that you prefer or that you utilize with your founders?

Tash Jefferies: It's always on this, so we have a KPI dashboard for our founders where it's the exact same thing.

So it's literally just an Excel spreadsheet. You've got a list of all the metrics that are important to your business, and you'll see that there's at end of week results for every single week that you're running. And what we do is we measure and take a look at, you know, what are your actual results coming in for that week?

And especially as it relates to your business development, my founders know if I see that you're supposed to be making a certain number of calls, or you're supposed to be running an ad and there's no results, or you said you didn't run an ad or you didn't talk to anybody, the first question I'm gonna ask you.

Okay. Well, How are we gonna get you talking to people? Cuz you need to talk to people. We cannot have a week where you're not talking to people. That's the, that's the lifeblood of your business. And so literally for, especially when it comes to business development, your KPIs shouldn't be that complicated to keep track of.

I called 20 people, you know, that's, I've reached 18 of them and three of them signed on.

Kelly Kennedy: Yep, and I, I think the big key too is like, I talk a lot about consistency, right? You can't call 18 people one day and then call five the next and then call 25 the next and then call three the next. That's not how, that's not gonna get you good results.

Absolutely. You need, you need to pick something that you can stick to. If that's 15, you don't mean, heck, even if that's 15 people a day, but you do it every single day, Absolut, that's gonna give you way better results than if you call 25 1 day five, the next 30, the next, then four, the next absolutely you if you can, right?

Tash Jefferies: It's just about true. It's habit, right? It's like, you know, everybody who knows me that's done a program knows I go to the gym five days a week and I can tell you, I feel like shit when I don't go to the gym in the morning and they'll see, oh, your energy's off today. Why? Because I missed, you know, missed the gym.

So guess what that means? I don't miss a gym because I know if I wanna hit my results and my metrics, I gotta go to the gym. And it's the same with like having that cadence, building up that like habit of, I'm calling 15 people a day. That's Yeah. 15 people a day. And once you do it, you'll notice that you're gonna get better, just like you were saying earlier, right?

Mm-hmm. The more people you talk to, the more you call, you're gonna see trends. They're gonna like those objections that you have to deal with. You're gonna, they're gonna just roll off your back once you know it's gonna be different from the first call to the hundredth call, but you'll notice that it gets easier and that's the only way to make it easier.

Like, build that habit and not be afraid to talk to people, find out what's going on.

Kelly Kennedy: Yeah. No, totally. And I think too one of the things that I wanna mention to this is when you're doing cold calls, the first couple are always a little bit tough, but what actually ends up happening is once you make 3, 4, 5, you hit a rhythm.

Yes. And you could make a hundred, like you have to make the first five calls to hit the rhythm. It's kind of like they talk about runners high, right? You can't get runners high unless you run. Well, guess what? You can't hit a cold call rhythm unless you pick up the phone and make a couple phone calls first.

Tash Jefferies: Absolutely. And it's so true. And it's honestly, it usually is the first five that's the hardest because yeah, you don't know what you're gonna hit on the other end. You don't know how people are gonna respond. Right. But then after you, you will get a feel for it once you start doing it. But you gotta do it and you can't.

Totally. Another thing that a lot of, you know, entrepreneurs and founders do is they say, oh, well I got this amazing product. I'm gonna hire this biz dev team to do it. If you cannot sell your product first, then even the best BizDev team and the best BizDev person like Kelly, like yourself, they can't do it.

If you couldn't do it, what makes you think that they're gonna do it?

Kelly Kennedy: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. It's like some of the first questions that capital business development has when we come on to a new client, right, is yeah, tell like, tell us about your product. Tell us what makes you compelling. What, what's your competitive advantage?

What's your story? Like, if you don't know what any of those things are, what you know, what sets you apart? If you don't have those answers for us, we can't make them up for you.

Tash Jefferies: That's exactly it.

Kelly Kennedy: But if you can, if you have those things and you do bring in a BizDev team, oh yeah, we're rock stars, but well, that's it, right?

But we, we, we are, we're rock stars. Because you were a rockstar up front in figuring out why you're compelling.

Tash Jefferies: 1000000%. That's exactly it. Yes. And a founder has to find that out. Like a founder can't come to a biz dev team and say, sell this for me. And, you know, the biz dev team asks, well, you know, how have you been selling it in closing?

And you say, well, I haven't been closing. Well, then they're not gonna work. You're throwing good money after bad.

Kelly Kennedy: Yeah. We, we need to, we need to talk about this.

Tash, we're coming to the end of our show and it sucks. Cause I've really enjoyed, I've really enjoyed our conversation. It's been absolutely amazing.

Tash Jefferies: Aw, thank you. It's awesome talking about this with you, Kelly.

Kelly Kennedy: I do wanna chat. I do wanna ask you just a couple more questions before we close off though.

I wanna know what your routine is. What is your, what does a day in Tash Jefferies life look like?

Tash Jefferies: Very simple. Gym. First thing. I went to the gym today. That's what gives me my glow. First thing in the morning. I don't skip breakfast. I'm always eating breakfast, high protein, lots of greens.

And then I spend time connecting with, usually I'm answering Fire emails from founders who are like, oh my gosh, we just lost our salesperson today. What are we gonna do? And it's like, yeah, okay. So catching up on those emails. And then I'm constantly developing programming, so a lot of my days are, how do I create content for founders so that they can keep making their, their, their startups better.

So that's usually my day. And then I binge watch Letter Kenny at night.

Kelly Kennedy: I just wanna say too, I feel like we probably have a second show here, so I think at some point we should definitely come back together again and chat again because I think you have a lot of you have a lot, you have a lot of experience in wellness, which I think is an important topic for entrepreneurs that I, I absolutely feel like at some point I would like to maybe chat about with you because I know even I've experienced a lot of challenges in business development with the wellness aspect of it having to be on all the time, even when you're not feeling on.

And it sucks cuz we didn't have enough time today to chat about that. But I do think that's something I would like to chat with you about in the future.

Tash Jefferies: You know what, that's my passion. I love that. That's actually that next part of, you know, again, I talk a lot about, and we talked about it here, about integrating your whole self.

Like again, we didn't even get into my viral meningitis. Healing story, but like, yeah. So the wellness part is near and dear to my heart because I wouldn't even be doing what I'm doing today had it not been for that big setback in my life. So yeah, there's definitely a part two coming somewhere down the line.

Kelly Kennedy: Yes. If you're up for, it'll come. Mark my words.

And I al I, I always wanna ask Right. I, you know, do you have any questions for me? Are there any questions that potentially I could answer for you on this show?

Tash Jefferies: You know what, I would love to, like, you talked a little bit, a bit about it, and I know you've mentioned it before, but like, what is that thing that gets you up in the morning?

I'm curious.

Kelly Kennedy: You know what? I love what I do and I love building great businesses cuz the reality is if somebody can't build these businesses, they will fail. And I hate the thought. I think of great businesses not getting a fair shot at it, especially when I know that they got a great product or service, right?

Like Capital Business Development. We don't take on projects, we don't believe in. One of my first kind of meetings, my first meeting I have with anybody is to understand if we are well aligned with what they're doing, if we believe in what they're doing. If the answer is no, we can't do it. Because if we don't believe in what you're doing, it's very hard to market it properly.

But yeah, for me, I think it's really just the idea that I can get out there and we can really be the difference in whether or not a business makes it or doesn't make it. And I, that thrills me. I love the idea of being able to get out there, market businesses, grow businesses, and, and just make people happy.

And then with this show, I get to essentially just inspire entrepreneurs and, and give away advice that frankly nobody gave me. Nobody gave me, there wasn't anything like this. There was no business development podcast when I got into business development. And there was a lot of questions I had that frankly, I couldn't find the answers to, or that I had to learn the hard way.

And I hope that with this podcast, that we are able to inspire business development people, inspire entrepreneurs, and frankly, give you the advice to make you successful that I never had.

Tash Jefferies: Well listen, Kelly, I'm gonna make a prediction and my founders know that I don't do this often, but I'm gonna make the prediction.

You said earlier, one of the things that kind of makes you sad is that a lot of people who give back don't get a chance to see their impact. I'm going to predict that you are going to see the impact from millions of listeners, and you're going to start hearing exactly the change and the difference that you make in their life.

And I say that because like you as a host, you as a business development person, as an entrepreneur, you have that it factor, and it is very rare. And so I appreciate you inviting me to be here to enjoy and experience it in real time. And I mean that sincerely.

Kelly Kennedy: Oh, you're, you're such a sap.

Tash Jefferies: My founders, no, I cry.

I cry. I cry at every demo day. It's never on camera, but as soon as that camera shuts off, I'm a volunteer is on the floor.

Kelly Kennedy: Oh, no, no. I really appreciate that, Tash. Yeah, no, I hope you're welcome. I hope, I hope that the show does, does inspire a lot of people. I really do. Well if you've enjoyed this conversation with Tash Jefferies, Tash, can you talk quickly about maybe some of the services that you can provide and how people could reach out to you if they've enjoyed the show?

Tash Jefferies: Absolutely easiest way is to find me on LinkedIn. I'm literally, Tashj is my handle. And feel free to reach out. Just look for the hair that is real. You can find me that way. And my, my only offering right now other than speaking and doing workshops for larger companies and accelerated programs, et cetera, is working with founders.

So if you are stuck, if you cannot get your sales or your customers or revenue to increase and you think you need someone to help, put a little bit of fire and light it up, then reach out to me because that is my ninja skill.

Kelly Kennedy: Oh, and mark my word, she is on fire. So you would not be making a poor choice if you have not seen this woman talk in front of people.

You have not seen nothing yet. Thank you, Kelly. It's an absolute pleasure having you on the show. This has been episode 28 of the Business Development Podcast, and even if you've enjoyed this show, please please like and follow us on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you listen. Leave us a review. I'd love to hear from you.

I'd love to hear it. I don't get too many reviews, so if you can leave us one, gosh, I really appreciate it, and until next time. I'll catch you on the flip side.

Outro: This has been the Business Development Podcast with Kelly Kennedy. Kelly has 15 years in sales and business development experience within the Alberta oil and gas industry, and founded his own business development firm in 2020.

His passion and his specialization is in customer relationship generation and business development. The show is brought to you by Capital Business Development, your Business Development specialists.

For more, we invite you to the website @ www.capitalbd.ca . See you next time on the Business Development Podcast.